Pouring corn vs planting corn - double standard?

[duckduckdog]

That quote was written for a discussion about turning public areas surrounding private impoundments into WMAs, not for the corning debate. Sorry, I should have mentioned that.

Didn't see this earlier

[sprigdog]

planting corn is beneficial to the duck populations. they have areas of food they can eat without being consistently molested. the corn is standing as we speak so the birds can have the energy to begin their short trip back to the north. .

i could be wrong, but a duck depends more on insects vice vegetation for fuel to head north. So, by everyone draining their corn ponds immediately after the season ends, it is doing more harm than good. Duck needs that standing water to eat bugs(arthropods??) hell, what do i know.

and, yes to the thread title. in my opinion of course.

[dixiedeerslaya]

maybe we should outlaw store bought night crawlers for shell cracker fishing... but you can use them if you grow them in your worm bed.... also you can use anything you want to catch catfish with including, but not limited to, store bought worms, crickets, shiners, bream, trotlines, bow and arrow......


hmmmm when you put it that way.....

[Take em']

I agree, the planted impoundments are a good thing, don't think that is the argument. But we need some food source on public land, whether that is baiting with corn, or some form of planting. Just something.

[Rubberhead*]

Just to be clear.

I am against any loosening of the baiting laws.

I am OK with the current laws that allow flooded corn as long as it's not manipulated or bush-hogged. The only thing that I know of that could sway me against the practice is it is found that the unnatural congregation of waterfowl around these "corn ponds" causes harm to waterfowl populations either through disease or nutrition problems. I still much prefer the moist-soil management that those of the "more mature" waterfowl managers used to do so well.

In other words, I don’t see growing corn as an art form worthy of great note. But, I do think proper moist-soil management is.

[tradorion]

And just to be clear- opinions are like..... well you know..... and we all have them....

and mine are no more valid than the next man's nor any less valid.

they are mine- some agree some disagree.... I don't really care.

BOTTOM LINE- the law is what it is and will not soon change until a politicians palm gets greased.... regardless of the worth of that law.

[Take em']

Rubberhead- Do you have access to hunt impoundments throughout the year?

[drwilly]

The only flaw in your duck hunting vs. capitalism comparison is that in a capitalistic society, the small business owner (public hunter) would be able to begin providing the same product (corn) in his limited area of the market. If the consumer (duck) liked his advertising better, then the consumer (duck) could begin giving his business to the small business owner (public hunter). However, as it stands, the law prohibits competing food sources and thus provides what some may percieve as an monopoly (or at least limited competion between corn ponds) to the corn pond association....Pure capitalism would allow the small business owner (public duck hunter) the ability to conduct his business (duck hunting) free from government interference.

I totally agree w where you are coming from. the analogy or relevance falls apart when you are talking about animals as opposed to rational free thinking people.

all land isn't equal if you want to plant and flood for ducks. the better land is expensive and basically cannot be created. it is relative location near to lakes, marshes, flyways, migration routes. so the question becomes what is it worth to "you", the individual duck hunter and how much are you willing to pay to play. imo turning it into a public v private issue only creates dissension and problems. what can be done to best manage on each is different. how much is too much govt intrusion is a whole other bag of worms that entires this discussion. making public land and state managed area duck hunting as good as can be, to be accessed by everyone equally and success based on amt of work and skill put into it is paramount. HOW to do that is certainly more difficult question and subject to many opinions.

[drwilly]

BOTTOM LINE- the law is what it is and will not soon change until a politicians palm gets greased.... regardless of the worth of that law.

that is an issue far broader than ducks in the river.

[jwilliams]

The only flaw in your duck hunting vs. capitalism comparison is that in a capitalistic society, the small business owner (public hunter) would be able to begin providing the same product (corn) in his limited area of the market. If the consumer (duck) liked his advertising better, then the consumer (duck) could begin giving his business to the small business owner (public hunter). However, as it stands, the law prohibits competing food sources and thus provides what some may percieve as an monopoly (or at least limited competion between corn ponds) to the corn pond association....Pure capitalism would allow the small business owner (public duck hunter) the ability to conduct his business (duck hunting) free from government interference.

Similar to US Manufacturing having to deal with EPA, EEOC,SHAC, W/C, Health Insurance, FDA, Labor Boards etc when China has no one to which they report? Pretty good analogy Snoopdog.

[Rubberhead*]

Didn't see this earlier

It was from a debate 10 years ago. I mentioned that when I posted it.

[Rubberhead*]

Rubberhead- Do you have access to hunt impoundments throughout the year?

Nope. 100% public with my bi-annual draw hunt.

[Blakeley]

What about the private landowner having to deal with ACOE, SCDHEC, OCRM, Clean Water Act, Coastal Zone Management Program, Rivers and Harbor Act, to maintain or enhance his land?

[Take em']

Nope. 100% public with my bi-annual draw hunt

.

I wasn't expecting that answer, but makes me value your opinion more. Thanks for sharing. I know you are against baiting but would you like to see some form of planting on public water?

[jwilliams]

If everyone baited on public land(or private), it would drastically reduce the effectiveness of baiting...NO LEGAL BAITING...

I am against legal baiting. It takes a lot out of hunting.

[tradorion]

ARTDEVILISH: I am against legal baiting. It takes a lot out of hunting.

hmmmmmmm- so tell me about the quality of hunting for the guy sitting in that impoundment he legally baits???

[drwilly]

trad, im not saying this is your position but it reminds of a point. jealousy or envy or bitterness toward "the rich plantation owner" shouldnt factor into a sound fair management plan ideally.

i like yachts and jets but can't afford one. but i dont feel like i should restrict regulate and penalize those who can. nor do i want rules passed to make them be limited to the same capabilities as cessnas and center consoles. just food for thought. i know it isnt exactly apples to apples in all areas but it is in some...fundamentally.

[tradorion]

To be very honest- it has next to nothing to do with jealousy as Duck Hunting is my very most favorite to do enforcement-wise and yet the VERY least on the list my time hunting-wise.... most of the time when i do hunt ducks in the midlands it is private holes and on the coast it is public water....

I get offers frequently to hunt private impoundments, managed green tree areas, and even tamie programs.... have tried all of these so i can safely say i have lived most any aspects of the waterfowling spectrum....

duck hunting is still the least of my interests- but one i have to work and live with and thus spend much time pondering.

it is not jealousy that drives my views at all...

[Take em']

I don't think jealousy is the issue either and I don't think private landowners need to be regulated to do anything different. However, I do believe public waters can and should be made more "attractive" to ducks and what attracts them is food. Anyway you put it, food (planted or poured) is baiting. Am I saying we should be allowed to pour corn on public water, not necessarily, but we should be working in some way to provide food sources in public water, similar to the private landowners. And I am not even saying the gov't/dnr has to provide the food via planting, just help with a plan so we (duck hunters) can put our time, money, and efforts into making our public land more "attractive" via some sort of food source. Bog has started a good thread with the natural grasses coming back to Santee Cooper, let's do more.

[Rubberhead*]

i like yachts and jets but can't afford one. but i dont feel like i should restrict regulate and penalize those who can. nor do i want rules passed to make them be limited to the same capabilities as cessnas and center consoles. just food for thought. i know it isnt exactly apples to apples in all areas but it is in some...fundamentally.

Amen, brother.