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Thread: Another QDM post.

  1. #1
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    I read mirrorman's post and want to pass on some more info on why QDM works. Killed a doe this weekend that had fetuses in her that were 39 days old. Do the math and it shows that this doe was bread on sept. 8th.Keep you buck to does ratio even or close and your does get bread early and you fawns have a great head start next year.Also makes for a very intense rut(rattling) .
    .
    80-20 Genaration

  2. #2
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    Allright I am fixin to ramble a bit..
    Why do you shoot smaller bucks?
    If you are shooting them for meat then why not shoot the does?
    Why don't you shoot the does?
    I understand taking youngsters out and letting them experience the thrill of the hunt and the kill, but isn't shooting small bucks giving them the wrong impression?
    Why not teach them to let the small ones walk and show them the results?
    QDMA takes time and I am nowhere near an expeert on this subject. I am not attacking anyone.
    I guess it all boils down to the experience that I had yesterday. I see what it can do and I AM HOOKED!!!!!
    Just givin my .02 and looking for some discussion on the topic..
    ----------------------------------<br />I\'m getting worser!!!

  3. #3
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    I don't think there is an experienced hunter out there who would not jump at the chance to harvest a 4.5 year old buck. So why don't we, as a state, have the management in place to limit the bucks shot, so that more bucks mature. I like the idea of having to check in does to get the buck tag. How many does is a function of the pop dynamics and expected harvest. It would give us all a much better average deer to shoot and promote a healthier herd and buck doe ratio.

    I know, I preach this all the time. But, I believe in much better management than SCDNR is doing.
    Leadership in Service<br /><br />Dream Big and Dare to Fail..<br /><br />\"And the sky was full of Anatadae\".. Mr. Buck

  4. #4
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    Excellent post Mirroman... You hit the nail on the head. I hope EVERYONE reads that.


    Originally posted by deadriver:
    I don't think there is an experienced hunter out there who would not jump at the chance to harvest a 4.5 year old buck. So why don't we, as a state, have the management in place to limit the bucks shot, so that more bucks mature.
    The reason is too many people have to brag about the number of "bucks" they have shot. Most guys think it is macho to kill only bucks. I hate trying to talk to these people... everyone wants to have an opportunity to shoot a nice deer, but most people are afraid to let a 16" buck walk for fear that someone else will shoot it... greed, pure and simple. "I'll shoot it before someone else does..."

    Deer do not belong to one parcel of land... the ones on yours cross the line just like ours. If we pass a 17" deer this year and the neighbor shoots it next year - great... we all participated in the management. If you want to have 3.5, 4.5 and 5.5 year old deer; it will take 3.5, 4.5 or 5.5 years from NOW to see the results.

    If you are happy just shooting basket racks forever... fine. That is all you will ever have - unless you raise some or some come from somewhere else. To each his own.
    "If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die, I want to go where they went."
    Will Rogers

  5. #5
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    i would jump at the chance to outwit a 7.5 year old doe over a 1.5 year old basket 6 point any day.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

  6. #6
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    I am sick of people saying how many bucks they shot. I have started responding to the quaestion of "how many bucks did you shoot" with, " I am a doe hunter!" Ii is easier than trying to explain to them that I pass up 15-25 shots a year.
    Leadership in Service<br /><br />Dream Big and Dare to Fail..<br /><br />\"And the sky was full of Anatadae\".. Mr. Buck

  7. #7
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    I think that most people here know that passing up young bucks and shooting does is good blah blah blah. BUT that idea of you are not allowed to shoot a buck in SC or get a "trophy" buck tag until you shoot does is Nazi bullshit. Good priciple though. Not practical.

    Duckman have your deer dropped their racks yet?

  8. #8
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    I agree with QDMA and would gladly follow it - wish it was a statewide plan. The club I was in over in Smoaks practiced it and we had great success. I miss it.

    I say that with a great big "but..."

    Not saying I am a butt, but you may disagree...

    Anyway...

    I am in a club now that does NOT, in any way, practice QDMA. I am in this club because it was available to me and convenient when nothing else presented itself. The membership of this club generally pass on smaller bucks, but don't turn their noses up at you if you pop one from time to time. The club is not big, less than 500 acres per tract (two nearby sections), surrounded on ALL sides by "if it's brown, it's down" folks. Therein lies the rub. I have seen so many spikes and fork horns taken off that other club that I wonder if it is worth it for us to even try.

    This past weekend, I broke down. I had not shot a buck in two years, since leaving Smoaks behind. It was literally the first chance this year I had been able to go deer hunting, and I was not sure when I would get to go again (work is, indeed, hell)

    I was presented with a shot at an immature buck and, yes, I shot him. Not proud of it, not really ashamed either. Will I do it again? Nope, not anytime soon. Not this year at any rate. I will be happy to just whack does from here on out, maybe get a chance on a big buck.

    But I ain't ashamed if it. It felt good, will taste good, and I enjoyed the hunt.

    Overall, though, I appreciate and agree with all that was said. I just wish I had the opportunity to go into the woods after deer more than about six days a year. (Maybe I will get out more this year).
    "Only accurate rifles are interesting " - Col. Townsend Whelen

  9. #9
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    Nope! But you can bet the peak of breading is past and the bucks are looking hard for the last hot does and scrapes are opening back up.The 2nd rut if you will!
    .
    80-20 Genaration

  10. #10
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    "I'll shoot it before someone else does..."
    Their hunting for the wrong reason if thats the way they look at it.
    .
    80-20 Genaration

  11. #11
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    Ghetto- You and I stay at odds on this issue. I don't mean this in any way against you, I mean it as stated. Ignorence is bliss. Agian, I am not saying that as an attack. What I am saying is, if you had been to some of the places I have been, you too would probably be very dissapointed in how we manage deer. As soon as you realize that you can do alot better with what you have, then you really want to.

    Also, the idea is suggested is similar to the suggestion put forth by our own DNR this year. Public hearingw were held in the Cola and Greenvill for limiting buck harvest. Hunters were unaccepting of the idea, so once again SCDNR backed of the biology and went back to managing politics.

    To suggest that I am a Nazi is childish and rediculous. You are a weak man if someone elses view threatens you that much. Also, I wonder if you would refer to T. Roosevelt and Gifford Pinchot, who established about 3/4 of the nations National Parks, as Nazi. People like you were up in arms as they bought and claimed land from individuals in order to protect and preserve special ecological areas of the country. What they did was not popular, many wildlife and resource laws through the years were not, but they are put in place to do what is RIGHT, NOT WHAT IS POPULAR.
    Ever been to the Smokies? There are still mountain peple today, which are very bitter about that land being taken from them. But, that Park recieves more visitors than Yellowstone, Yosemite, and the Grand Canyon combined. So, I think they did the honorable thing by setting the land aside.

    You need to understand one thing: They are not your deer!!! All game belongs to the state. You are definitely a part of the problem, not the solution.

    Fortunately, as more people spend more money each year on deer, most of which want better quality deer management, policitics will drive a trend for change. The biology involved with doe ratios,natural selection, overpopulation, and chronic wasting disease seem of little importance to out DNR, but mob opinion is a heavy hammer.
    Leadership in Service<br /><br />Dream Big and Dare to Fail..<br /><br />\"And the sky was full of Anatadae\".. Mr. Buck

  12. #12
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    Too many people want change with the times. They are stuck on the "doe has the young" shoot the male philosopy, or that we are over populated with deer so shoot them all.
    More fuel = more boost!!

  13. #13
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    Education! As for not shooting does because they have more deer think about this. We have 6000 acres, For the first 10 year we shot every doe that would give us the chance. Close to 100 a year! We still have lots of deer! Now, As a result of that we have a even buck to does ratio and also by checking fetuses from harvested does have learned that the twin fawn and buck fawn rate have INCREASED! You will not kill all your deer by shooting enough does to even out your ratio.
    .
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  14. #14
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    Exactly KRT. But, I was not saying shoot all of the deer, if that was directed at me. The idea of having to check in does to get a buck tag is not my own. That is what they are doing in some of the Northern States such as Michigen and Wisconsin. In WI, as of this year, you have to shoot a doe to be able to shoot your buck. That at least will allow for natuarl buck to doe ratios in about 5 years when the whole herd is replaced by deer that have come along since the law went into place.

    Natural Ratio according to NY states deer pen studies in the 40's is 49 does to, 51 bucks. To my knowledge, all further research has only proven that to be true.

    So if we did that you would have to shoot a doe for every buck, we would all see a buck for every doe we saw in 5 years time. But, that is my Nazi influence from the guys up North dealing with CWD comeing East of the Miss.
    Leadership in Service<br /><br />Dream Big and Dare to Fail..<br /><br />\"And the sky was full of Anatadae\".. Mr. Buck

  15. #15
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    Deadriver that wasn't directed at you. Just saying too many people are listening to the "ole timers philosophy"
    More fuel = more boost!!

  16. #16
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    The reason that more does are not shot, is that a lot of people remember 20-30 years ago when we did not have the deer population we have now. We shot bucks only then because we did not want to take out the ones who were giving new offspring every year. Old habits die hard.
    "If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die, I want to go where they went."
    Will Rogers

  17. #17
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    Deadriver, calm down dude. You are freaking out. I didn't call you a Nazi. You are saying I'm ignorant and a "weak man" and that's fine. I said that you or the state dictating what size and sex of deer people have to kill is Nazi bullshit. And I know that I don't own deer. Quit making up BS arguements about stuff I didn't even say. I skimmed over something about going to the smokies?

    You won't find anything on this site about me disagreeing with shooting does or passing up deer.

  18. #18
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    This topic has not been discussed the way I figured it would be. I thought about it last night and I really hope no one took it the wrong way. Everyone who has replied seems to be pretty much on the same page with one another. But where are the hunters who don't practice QDMA?? I am very curious about some reasons..
    Here,I will sit on the other side of the fence.
    Swamp Rat brought up a good point. Some people just do not have as much time to get in the woods as others. It definitely takes time to kill a trophy buck. Or dumb luck...(which might be my case) If that is the case then shoot a doe...
    Bow hunters-- I have mixed feelings about this one. I have NEVER bow hunted before, just haven't had the desire. I can understand that it is a huge accomplishment to kill a deer with a bow, I can even understand killing a small buck for your first bow kill or first buck with a bow, but once you kill a small one with the bow then it is just an excuse to shoot after that.
    I just got side tracked and lost my train of thought, so I will stop now.
    Bottom line is that everyone will make mistakes. Esp. if you hunt enough. Also we will never get everyone to take up QDMA in this state. Too much greed out there. Others just don't care. My experience this weekend has changed my views more than anyone can imagine. It has been 9 years since I killed a buck worth mounting or really even was proud of. Well I am pround once again, and if I have to wait 9 more years then so be it, but I am gonna keep after em.
    ----------------------------------<br />I\'m getting worser!!!

  19. #19
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    There's one thing I don't understand, and this is not meant as a shot at anyone. What is it that makes someone want to shoot a small buck?

    The reason I ask is Swamp Rat mentioned he took one recently because he hasn't killed a buck in a couple of years. I know we're all different and have our reasons for doing what we do but that's one thing I've never been able to comprehend. I've been reading this board for a while and I have yet to see a good reason why someone makes that decision.

    I'd like to think it's because there is no good reason, but it probably has more to do with the fact I'm a dumbass.

    I'd prefer to shoot a doe over a basket 8 any day. The meat usually tastes a little better and there's always the hope that I'll see that 8 next year when he's a nicer 8 or even a 10.

    I've always wondered how many guys on here that complain about the SCWA birds shoot small bucks. In my very warped opinion, shooting a small/young buck is much like shooting the "tamies", or at least how tamie shooting has been described by so many on here. It's too easy. A 1.5 or 2.5 year old buck isn't as savy and hard to hunt as one that has been given an opportunity to age.

    I guess no one is right and no one is wrong in this argument. It's all about opinions. Mine is that you should let it walk unless you're going to put him on the wall. To each his own.

  20. #20
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    MM, I obviously can't speak for any other bowhunters out there. I started bowhunting with a compound about six or seven years ago, and have bowhunted exclusively for the last four years, both with a compound and recurve. I missed a nice eight point with a bow about six years ago that I later killed with a rifle. I still regret not trying harder to kill that one with the bow. Anyway, since then I have only killed one buck with the bow. It was a decent six point three years ago. I have killed several does in that time, and had shots at several small bucks. I watched a four point two weeks ago walk right under my stand, and watched a really nice six eat acorns within fifteen yards of my stand last Saturday. Both times I was just wishing I had a camera (although I was thinking about where I would have put the arrow and when I could have taken the shot).

    I have decided that I will continue to shoot does and wait until I get a shot at a buck worth putting on the wall. If it happens this year that would be great, but if I don't get a shot at one for the next few years I think I will be okay with that, too. I just would not get anything out of shooting a smallish buck and would rather pop a doe. I actually get more satisfaction from killing a doe with the sticks than I ever have from killing any deer with a gun. Even a doe is a trophy, IMHO.

    My two cents, for what little it's worth. I'll be interested to see what some of the other bowhunters on the site say, although I would guess that it will be along the same lines.

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