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Thread: Red snapper season

  1. #21
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    Also, I'm not speaking from mere speculation here. I've got 100's of hours invested in this issue and went to several of the SAMFC and other organized public meetings to get this info first hand. Many communications with CCA, etc also. They (CCA) had asked me to join the council as their rep, but I don't have time for 4 weeks of unpaid meetings every year for something like this.

    Ultimately the issue is the underlying age distribution model they are using and they way that they interpret the data. This wasn't an issue when they thought red snapper only lived to 20 years. They found 3 specimens that they aged over the age of 50 and plugged that into their model. Now they expect a "distribution" of certain age groups across that model. For example, if a fish lives to the age of 50, then they expect to find X number of 40 year old fish, and Y number of 30 year old fish, etc. when they do sampling. But they don't see that, so the assumption is that overfishing is still occurring.
    Last edited by jasonw; 05-04-2022 at 10:04 AM.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by BOGSTER View Post
    Gentlemen,

    There are more keeper snapper and grouper caught off privately made reefs in sight of land than you would ever imagine.

    I’ve heard tell that if you were to get yourself 5-6 old dryers, removed the doors and sunk them at an undisclosed location, you could catch them too.
    Old toilets work great!

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jasonw View Post
    The problem with that is that there would only be a few thousand tags for a few hundred thousand fishermen. It's all based around quota and the quota has been TINY... 95% of the tags would go to people in Florida because of the population size and number of SW licenses sold there. So, point being, it would not be like you are expecting it, and it would be even worse than what we have now.

    The ONLY real solution is that SC gives SAFMC the finger and red snapper is completely turned over to the state, completely out of federal jurisdiction. And even that is a stretch since most of that old RS data and scientists were from SC waters.
    I wasn't referring to a lottery system, more like you get X number of tags with your license fees much like deer and turkey tags. And like deer and turkey tags, many/most would go unfilled. You'd also have the ability to purchase extra tags like you do with deer tags if you so choose.

    The FU protest of paying the fine in bulk won't work, it's the gubmint, they'd call in the news channels and frog march rogue fishermen away in handcuffs or execute them on the docks over a fish. Heck, they'd probably blockade ever inlet and sink any boats coming out, Bart would never get to use his Freeman then.
    Yeah, but do you consider a dog to be a filthy animal? I wouldn't go so far as to call a dog filthy but they're definitely dirty. But, a dog's got personality. Personality goes a long way.


    You might take out a dozen before they drag you from your home and skull fuck you to death. Marsh Chicken 6/21/2013

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saltydog235 View Post
    I wasn't referring to a lottery system, more like you get X number of tags with your license fees much like deer and turkey tags. And like deer and turkey tags, many/most would go unfilled. You'd also have the ability to purchase extra tags like you do with deer tags if you so choose.

    The FU protest of paying the fine in bulk won't work, it's the gubmint, they'd call in the news channels and frog march rogue fishermen away in handcuffs or execute them on the docks over a fish. Heck, they'd probably blockade ever inlet and sink any boats coming out, Bart would never get to use his Freeman then.
    I disagree. We (dirty fishermen) call the news channel. We wait in line. Dockside sit in. Silent protest. It would call attention on a state and if coordinated properly, a national level. It's all about $ and the privatization of a resource. When a guy in Texas owns
    1/4 of the commercial quota in the Gulf you can be sure as shit stinks that he is doing everything he can to make sure the recreational fisherman gets the dregs. What do you think is happening here in the Atlantic?
    Louisiana said FU and opened up state waters but the difference is (yes BOG there are legal snappers in State waters here) that state has much better state waters for red snapper. Seen it. Done it.
    Quote Originally Posted by walt4dun View Post
    Monsters... Be damned if I'd ever be taken alive by the likes of faggot musslims.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    I am an equal opportunity hater.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by willk View Post
    I disagree. We (dirty fishermen) call the news channel. We wait in line. Dockside sit in. Silent protest. It would call attention on a state and if coordinated properly, a national level. It's all about $ and the privatization of a resource. When a guy in Texas owns
    1/4 of the commercial quota in the Gulf you can be sure as shit stinks that he is doing everything he can to make sure the recreational fisherman gets the dregs. What do you think is happening here in the Atlantic?
    Louisiana said FU and opened up state waters but the difference is (yes BOG there are legal snappers in State waters here) that state has much better state waters for red snapper. Seen it. Done it.
    Yeah, the fact that somebody "owns" a portion of a public resource ticks me off too.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saltydog235 View Post
    I wasn't referring to a lottery system, more like you get X number of tags with your license fees much like deer and turkey tags. And like deer and turkey tags, many/most would go unfilled. You'd also have the ability to purchase extra tags like you do with deer tags if you so choose.

    The FU protest of paying the fine in bulk won't work, it's the gubmint, they'd call in the news channels and frog march rogue fishermen away in handcuffs or execute them on the docks over a fish. Heck, they'd probably blockade ever inlet and sink any boats coming out, Bart would never get to use his Freeman then.
    I'm not saying you are suggesting a lottery system. What I am saying is that your math does not work out. The "Annual Catch Limit" of RS on the eastern seaboard is about 42K fish which 72% is allocated to recreational fishermen. That means only 30K fish allowed per year for harvest for the entire east region (SC, NC, FL, GA). In FL alone there are 1.5 million saltwater licenses sold in a year (FY 19/20). So, tell me how the math works. Even if you gave each person only 1 tag, and even if only 10% of them are filled, you are still 5x over the quota IN FLORIDA ALONE... That doesn't count SC, NC, GA (all share the same quota) And honestly, I don't remember if "release mortality" is counted towards that ACL, which I believe it is. That means that SAFMC factors that X number of fish are released and die each year. If I am not mistaken, that alone wipes out your ACL. So again, tag system has never been an option if they hold fast to their catch numbers. The only reason why we even have a 3 days season is because of political pressure. But again, the NGOs are also suing the other way (against us).

    Thus, even if there were some sort of quota there, the lottery system would be the only thing that could mathematically be considered, and as you could see, neither me nor you are lucky enough to get a tag statistically speaking.

    Not defending it. I don't like it, but I'm telling you this so people can rationalize why it has not been done.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by willk View Post
    I disagree. We (dirty fishermen) call the news channel. We wait in line. Dockside sit in. Silent protest. It would call attention on a state and if coordinated properly, a national level. It's all about $ and the privatization of a resource. When a guy in Texas owns
    1/4 of the commercial quota in the Gulf you can be sure as shit stinks that he is doing everything he can to make sure the recreational fisherman gets the dregs. What do you think is happening here in the Atlantic?
    Louisiana said FU and opened up state waters but the difference is (yes BOG there are legal snappers in State waters here) that state has much better state waters for red snapper. Seen it. Done it.
    If that was really feasible it would have been done by now. The fact is, people don't give enough shits about it and there aren't enough willing fisherman to pull a million man march over red snapper. This is NOT about privatization at all. This is due to the fact that the junior scientists of the SEDAR\SAFMC don't know their asses from a hole in the ground. They are applying what they know ("model") about hogfish in the keys to a species that does not fit that model. Why? Because it's their "best science". They are not engineers and have no problem solving ability. Scientists are supposed to observe. Engineers solve problems.

    What the "agenda" really is, is that Greg Waugh want's lazy management like that in the Bahamas. if you have ever spoken to him in person he is quick to hold up this example and the example in the Tortugas with a proud smile on his face. His genuine core belief is that you rope off enough live bottom with no fishing (i.e. "MPAs") and as long as those protect enough breeders that they will always sustain a minimum fish stock. Anything that happens outside of that zone doesn't ultimately matter because those fish are "spillover" in a sense. The view is that the MPAs are the "golden goose" and the fish outside of the MPAs are the golden eggs. Protect the goose and you always have the eggs. Most do not recall, but at the start of this debacle the SAFMC moved to close ALL bottom fishing > 98 feet deep of water. Does anyone remember this ballsy move?
    Last edited by jasonw; 05-05-2022 at 07:53 AM.

  8. #28
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    Well, it doesn't really look like it matters what the season is. That forecast for SC's waters is something Bart won't even fish in his Freeman.

    IMG_2350.jpg
    Yeah, but do you consider a dog to be a filthy animal? I wouldn't go so far as to call a dog filthy but they're definitely dirty. But, a dog's got personality. Personality goes a long way.


    You might take out a dozen before they drag you from your home and skull fuck you to death. Marsh Chicken 6/21/2013

  9. #29
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    Yep...that's a hard no for me

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckcrazed View Post
    Yep...that's a hard no for me
    No doubt, Sailflow is 4.5, NOAA is 5-8 basically Friday through Saturday, Bouyweather has it as a SCA.
    Yeah, but do you consider a dog to be a filthy animal? I wouldn't go so far as to call a dog filthy but they're definitely dirty. But, a dog's got personality. Personality goes a long way.


    You might take out a dozen before they drag you from your home and skull fuck you to death. Marsh Chicken 6/21/2013

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckcrazed View Post
    Yep...that's a hard no for me
    Take a Dramamine, you big woosy.

  12. #32
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    No doubt….pfft

  13. #33
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    We should have chartered the New Inlet Princess,

    SC Ducks members only,

    It would have been epic!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  14. #34
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    You can always count on there being waves on my birthday which is the 9th .
    867-5309

  15. #35
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    Hopefully we will get another weekend

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by b35w View Post
    Hopefully we will get another weekend
    Quote Originally Posted by walt4dun View Post
    Monsters... Be damned if I'd ever be taken alive by the likes of faggot musslims.
    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    I am an equal opportunity hater.

  17. #37
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    Still trying to understand why bottom fishing for a snapper drives people so crazy.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernWake View Post
    Still trying to understand why bottom fishing for a snapper drives people so crazy.
    Because for two days out of the year, you don’t have to throw them back. It’s like bonus fishing.
    Yeah, but do you consider a dog to be a filthy animal? I wouldn't go so far as to call a dog filthy but they're definitely dirty. But, a dog's got personality. Personality goes a long way.


    You might take out a dozen before they drag you from your home and skull fuck you to death. Marsh Chicken 6/21/2013

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saltydog235 View Post
    Because for two days out of the year, you don’t have to throw them back. It’s like bonus fishing.
    And they are delicious

  20. #40
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    "Throw 'em back"


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