I know this is an older thread but I can tell you that an intelligent dog trained to an e collar is a beautiful and humane thing. My dogs are trained to a wireless invisible fence and neither now have a need to wear the e collar to respect the boundary. I use the collar on. limited bases in retriever training but almost never in the field. However, some dogs will run through an invisible fence and will ignore an electric chair's worth of shock, especially if the person operating it is not themselves trained in its operation.

If you have ever watched a dog being forced-fetched trained, then you will understand that the collar is not nearly the worse thing that can be done to a dog. MG