View Poll Results: What to do with Cat 1 WMA's for waterfowl

Voters
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  • Stop wasting the money and turn into Cat 2

    21 17.50%
  • Fund whatever it takes to repair and manage.

    29 24.17%
  • Fund it but roll some heads at DNR

    68 56.67%
  • Give up on Samworth and Delta

    2 1.67%
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Thread: Cat 1 WMA funding

  1. #21
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    The catch phrase for wetland protection today is "water quality."
    \"I never saw a wild thing feel sorry for itself. A small bird will drop dead frozen from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.\" <br />D.H. LAWRENCE

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calibogue View Post
    The catch phrase for wetland protection today is "water quality."
    The only change in the quality I see in that scenario is that they now have Macallan 18 on the bar of the brand new clubhouse instead of the dusty old green bottle of Cutty under the counter...

  3. #23
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    Haha
    \"I never saw a wild thing feel sorry for itself. A small bird will drop dead frozen from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.\" <br />D.H. LAWRENCE

  4. #24
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    Here's one reason why we don't sell the Cat I's...

    Ephesians 2 : 8-9



    Charles Barkley: Nobody doesn't like meat.

  5. #25
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    The Delta properties are playing against a stacked deck.

    The GPD has been inside her banks maybe 6 weeks out of the last 52. Why? Because all of the flood plains in NC were flooded for lake property. All their overflow dumps into SC. Also consider Horry County doles out building permits like Halloween candy. Wetlands and flood plain is filled in or ditched (to the river). All of the Waccamaw's water has no where to go. If the GPD is at flood stage, it will back up all the other rivers until she's a little less angry.

    Lets not forget the water flowing from the Saluda, Broad, and Wateree rivers on the south side of the Delta when half of it used to flow into the Charleston harbor...It's a given the dikes and flood control structures are going to get washed out.

    It's common sense that when you don't empty the ashtray if the house is on fire so funding and manpower is committed to keeping the dikes intact and water instead of being proactive.

    IMHO you're just kicking the can down the road unless you start addressing how, when and where all of SC and half of NC's water flows.
    Last edited by BigBrother; 11-20-2020 at 10:20 AM.
    "Rivers and the inhabitants of the watery elements are for wise men to contemplate and for fools to pass by without consideration" -Izaak Walton

  6. #26
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    That is all true and it isn't just lake developments. Our little city of Hendersonville had a flooding problem from building 4 large grocery stores on 60 acres with all that comes with them and only one small creek to carry the runoff. So, what did they do?

    They built a 5th grocery store in, I shit you not, the creek. Just moved that bitch right on into some culverts, piled on the fill, and more delicious Boars Head cold cuts for all.

    Insanity, but it is what it is and it won't change past more bullshit regulation for the small guy trying to make a living while the big chains bulldoze on.

    The State wildlife managers don't stand a chance at something they shouldn't even be doing in the first place.

    I will keep saying it. Why do you people think that you are entitled to hunt like 1920's oil tycoons in the first place for $50 a year?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by JABIII View Post
    Why do you people think that you are entitled to hunt like 1920's oil tycoons in the first place for $50 a year?
    Because the 1920's oil tycoons said so when they willed the property to the state.
    Ephesians 2 : 8-9



    Charles Barkley: Nobody doesn't like meat.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubberhead* View Post
    Because the 1920's oil tycoons said so when they willed the property to the state.
    I guess it isn't much difference from all of the "willing" that they have been piling on the taxpayer's backs since the dawn of time...

  9. #29
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    Jul 2020
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    No offense to anyone who works for the state. But in most if not all cases, folks are correct in thinking the maintenance and improvements could be done better at the state level. The idea of turning these projects over to private contractors is at least something they should try. Owning the property in perpetuity is good to be done collectively, but projects are time and time again proven to be completed cheaper and on time by private entities. Let the state biologists come up with the plan, bid it out and then oversee the final projects. It works for all sorts of other projects.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by union View Post
    No offense to anyone who works for the state. But in most if not all cases, folks are correct in thinking the maintenance and improvements could be done better at the state level. The idea of turning these projects over to private contractors is at least something they should try. Owning the property in perpetuity is good to be done collectively, but projects are time and time again proven to be completed cheaper and on time by private entities. Let the state biologists come up with the plan, bid it out and then oversee the final projects. It works for all sorts of other projects.
    Back on track, good post. PL isn't talking about selling anything. He is looking for some discussion on management for a budget that we elected him to oversee...

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by JABIII View Post

    I will keep saying it. Why do you people think that you are entitled to hunt like 1920's oil tycoons in the first place for $50 a year?
    Ding ding

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by union View Post
    No offense to anyone who works for the state. But in most if not all cases, folks are correct in thinking the maintenance and improvements could be done better at the state level. The idea of turning these projects over to private contractors is at least something they should try. Owning the property in perpetuity is good to be done collectively, but projects are time and time again proven to be completed cheaper and on time by private entities. Let the state biologists come up with the plan, bid it out and then oversee the final projects. It works for all sorts of other projects.
    There is no universal best answer when considering the choices of 1) actual state employees doing the work and 2) actual state employees bidding out the work. Both of them depend on the state employees being honest and competent. That seems to be a big ask these days...
    Ephesians 2 : 8-9



    Charles Barkley: Nobody doesn't like meat.

  13. #33
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    Oct 2012
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    As long as the neighbors are productively managing and producing waterfowl with less money and some are even making money, well then the problem is easy to identify - hint- its not money, nor is it weather.

    In any effort your staff and leadership are key to success or the reason for mission failure.
    Genesis 9;2

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubberhead* View Post
    There is no universal best answer when considering the choices of 1) actual state employees doing the work and 2) actual state employees bidding out the work. Both of them depend on the state employees being honest and competent. That seems to be a big ask these days...
    Correct , as to lower level employment to mid level employment hiring practices, I have seen it time and time again, Farm raised John boy with cracked hands and dirty finger nails and a degree or bushels full of real world experience gets passed over for greased hair, fair skinned and soft handed . Is it because upper level doesn't like John boy , is it because soft hands dad knows somebody or is it because upper level fears John boy or maybe just doesn't like his kind.

    I think its a combo of they don't like his kind plus hiring teddy promotes not only the excuse for money due to failure but also scratches the back of teddys dad. Now mind you this is coming from someone who slipped the cracks and caught the fragrance from the inside. Now with that in mind when it comes to the state subcontracting out the work that sure does allow for some convenient transferring of funds and favors.
    Genesis 9;2

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strick9 View Post
    Now with that in mind when it comes to the state subcontracting out the work that sure does allow for some convenient transferring of funds and favors.
    Not talking about management but fixing dikes, trunks, etc the state already contracts out alot of the major projects. The problem is when proper maintenance is not done(because of various reasons) and the term “an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure” can never ring more true.
    Quote Originally Posted by Glenn View Post
    I'll shoot over a kids head in a blind or long gun one on a turkey in a heart beat. You want to kill stuff around me you gonna earn it.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by union View Post
    No offense to anyone who works for the state. But in most if not all cases, folks are correct in thinking the maintenance and improvements could be done better at the state level. The idea of turning these projects over to private contractors is at least something they should try. Owning the property in perpetuity is good to be done collectively, but projects are time and time again proven to be completed cheaper and on time by private entities. Let the state biologists come up with the plan, bid it out and then oversee the final projects. It works for all sorts of other projects.
    To springboard off that comment, what if a certain number of WMA's were allowed to be contracted out, and other WMA's managed by state employees, and the results compared? Experimental group and a control group. There is no deadline on "getting this right", but continuing down the same path and not changing a dang thing seems dumb.
    "Hunt today to kill tomorrow." - Ron Jolly

  17. #37
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    What's interesting is someone mentioned about the old tycoons donating their land. The reality is that today's tycoons are not nearly as philonthropic as the rich of yesteryear, more so because their values don't align with "blood sports". You kind of wouldn't want someone like Jack Dorsey stroking a check for $100m since most if not all mega rich today are anti hunters and down right anti american. I do wonder if organizations such as Ducks Unlimited or Delta have comparative results on private land with budgets that could be compared to the results the state gets. Would be interesting for sure.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by buckpro View Post
    Not talking about management but fixing dikes, trunks, etc the state already contracts out alot of the major projects. The problem is when proper maintenance is not done(because of various reasons) and the term “an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure” can never ring more true.
    That is what the state has been doing since Emily Cope took office. Now SCDNR doesn't even write their own repair grants. In days past, a man who had grown up farming or in hard work and who had a love of waterfowl was hired for the job and everything was completed in house by the manager and staff and it was done well and through hurricanes and flooding etc.

    Now Most anything of substances is put through the NAWCA process by DU to include original scope of work write up, design, engineering, approval, permitting, fund collection, bidding and contractor awarding. All this happens with little to no oversight and since DU has the strong arm any field staff from the old school that see items of oversight that need attention or correction while repair are told to stand in the corner.

    I am perfectly happy with subbing all the work out , its the oversight in the end that counts and that should be done by a non biased party.
    Genesis 9;2

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by tman View Post
    To springboard off that comment, what if a certain number of WMA's were allowed to be contracted out, and other WMA's managed by state employees, and the results compared? Experimental group and a control group. There is no deadline on "getting this right", but continuing down the same path and not changing a dang thing seems dumb.
    Excellent idea, we were working on some of this recently and were shut down. The state has zero intentions of being showed up which means they can't show.. Ironically the neighboring properties are doing just that time and time again.
    Genesis 9;2

  20. #40
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    58 responded to poll.

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    Either write things worth reading, or do things worth writing.

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