Charleston SC

[Pcole]

Fortunately, I can read, so I get the gist of the discussion. Again, just don't know what you were looking for.

Because I wasn't looking for anything. I was jerking roddie's chain because he only posts on political posts- which is fine- more power to him. You however, regularly chime in on my posts trying to make me look stupid - on the public forum- and then send me PM's saying you're not coming after me and you respect my opinion, yada yada yada. I'll tell you here like I tell you there: it's opinion, I'm not above being wrong, I don't disrespect anyone until they disrespect me, and I won't be intimidated or have my words twisted in to something I didn't say.

[Black Bart]

Because I wasn't looking for anything. I was jerking roddie's chain because he only posts on political posts- which is fine- more power to him. You however, regularly chime in on my posts trying to make me look stupid - on the public forum- and then send me PM's saying you're not coming after me and you respect my opinion, yada yada yada. I'll tell you here like I tell you there: it's opinion, I'm not above being wrong, I don't disrespect anyone until they disrespect me, and I won't be intimidated or have my words twisted in to something I didn't say.

A few of y'all come across as angry. And everything that's goin' on has really brought it to light. Yikes.

[Black Bart]

...and for the record, I meant what I said when I PM'd you. However, betraying my trust sheds some additional light on who I'm dealing with, so thanks for that insight.

[Pcole]

I'm not angry, and I have no intention of betraying your trust. I just don't get that you act one way toward me in one setting and another in a different setting. Like me or not, what you see is what you get. You and I have gone toe to toe and we've agreed fervently. Some political BS going on around us isn't going to change that.

[SCDAWG]

I just back ......
damn Clemson fans

[JJ1965]

I just back ......
damn Clemson fans

[ecu1984]

Here is some history that will shed light on a side of slavery not thought or talked too much about.
The 5th or 6th Great Grandfather, named who he left his 81 slaves to by name in his will.
Listed in his bible, were the names of every slave he ever owned.
And after the war, 90% remained on the farm in warren County, NC.
I am confused, does that make me a racist?

From the Will of NATHANIEL MACON, dtd Aug 10, 1833:
To my grandson WILLIAM EATON JUNIOR:
HARRY and his wife HESTER
old man FRANK and his wife DOLLY

To my grandson NATHANIEL M. MARTIN:
PHIL and his wife CHINA

I lend to my grandson in law Drury S.MARTIN:
GINNY and her daughter

Slaves EPHRAIM and LUCY to which grandchild they prefer

Half of remainder of Slaves to go to all the children of my late daughter BETSY K. MARTIN (except NATHANIEL M. MARTIN)

The other half, one third part to my grandson WILLIAM PATON JUNR.
The other two thirds to my grandchildren BETSY K. M. FIELD (wife of EATON FIELD) BUCKNER EATON and CHARLES PATON (children of my daughter SEIGNORA) to be equally divided between them.

An Inventory of the Estate of NATHANIEL MACON dec'd returned by his Executor W. N. EDWARDS to November Sessions 1837:
List of Slaves - Eighty in number-

Old Frank
Lucy
Ephraim
Polly
Minny
Dan
Harry
Sally
Phil
Nelly
Lew
Mary
Neaton
Effy
Cloe
Little Polly
Moses
Nelson
Billy
Priscilla
Aaron
Isaiah
Betty
Brown
Nancy
Huldy
Tempe
Easter
Katy
Maria
John
Miranda
Aggy
Mansfield
Owen
Robert
Cornelius
Milly
Molly
Willis
Eliza
Essex William
Martha
Emanuel
Sprigg
Solomon
Amy
Cary
Betsy
Frederick
Nassery
Chana
Lucretia
Julia Ann
Phil
Lydia
Nathan
Isaac
Rhody
Littleton
Hannah
Weldon
Jacob
Willis
Peter
Perry
Janet
George
Clary
Also born since death of Testator:
Tony
Martha
Henry

Also:
Jenny & Child- in possession of Drury S. Marrow
Harriet- in possession of Col. Jos. Maclin & Wife
Susanna- in possession of Henry L. Martin
Matilda- in possession of Nath'l M. Martin
Rachel- in possession of Wm. K. Martin
Lucinda- in possession of William Eaton Jr.


Following list of about 123 Slaves with their dates of birth were found
Nathaniel Macon Bible:
KATE born 1743
HUMPHREY born 1740
GEORGE born 1755
FRANK born 20 Feby 1754
BOB born 1756
ISBELL born 1754- dead
LUCY born 1759
EPHRAIM born 8 May 1765
TITUS born 1769
POLLY born 1769
MINNA born 1773
VENUS born 1772
ANTHONY born 1778
ADAM born 1782
DAN born 1782
TOM born 1783
SABRINA born 1779
NELLE born 1779 - dead
HARRY born 1785
GREAT ESTHER born 1780
TANSY born 1785
FRANK born 26 Dec'r 1785
ESTHER born 20 Dec'r 1787
JANE born 1788
JAMES SPRIGG born 12 Feby 1789
BETTY born 20 June 1791
JOHN born 1793
SOLOMON born 1794
JAMES born 1795
STEPHEN born 1796
BILLEY born 1796
HANNAH born Sept 1796
SALLEY born 26 April 1798
PLEASANT born 1799
PRISCILLA born 1798
NELLE born 5 Jany 1800
ANNA born 10 June 1800
PHILL born 1799
CLAIBORNE born 8 April 1801
NORVAL born 20 April 1801
LEWIS born 10 May 1801
JOHN born August 1802
MARY born 3 March 1803
NANCY born 26 Oct'r 1804
WINNY born 2 june 1804
PATSEY born 8 July 1804
NEATON born 3 June 1805
SABRINA born 3 July 1805
OSCAR born 13 January 1807
EFFY born 1780
CLOE born 1800
POLLY born 1802
MOSES born 1804
NELSON born 1806
BILLY born 1808
SPRIG born January 1810
PHOEBE born 25 April 1810
PRISCILLA born 2 June 1812
AARON born 19 March 1814
ISAIAH 20 July 1814
MAT 1 February 1816
BETTY bought of Mr. MYRICK JONES[?]
Negro of SALLY


MILLEY 20 May 1816 dead
BROWN 4 May 1817
NANCY 27 May 1817
HULDAH 28 January 1818
TEMPE 26 September 1818
ESTHER 19 January 1819
CATY 6 May 1819
MARIA 22 January 1820
JOHN 23 January 1820
MIRANDA 27 Sept'r 1820
MANSFIELD 7 Feby 1821
AGGEY 16 May 1821
OWEN 16 Jany 1822
ROBERT 14 June 1822
CORNELIUS 27 Jany 1823
RACHEL 23 June 1823
MILLEY 20 July 1823
SUSANNA 7 September 1823
CHEESMAN 8 October 1823
HARRIET 25 October 1824
LUCINDA 24 May 1825
GEORGE 31 August 1825
MOLLY 6 Sept'r 1825
PLUMMER 4 March 1827
WILLIS 1795
ELIZA 12 June 1827
ESSEX 28 July 1827
HENRY 31 July 1827
CRITTY 12 August 1827
WILLIAM 5 Jany 1828
MARTHA 15 April 1828
EMMANUEL 17 Jany 1829
SPRIG 20 May 1829
SOLOMON 3 June 1829
AMY 20 September 1829
WATLEY 28 Nov'r 1829
CAREY 1 Nov'r 1830
BETSEY 20 Feby 1831
FREDERIC 10 April 1831
NORSWORTHY 20 May 1831
CHINA 1804
MATILDA 15 Sept'r 1824
LUCRETIA 15 Oct'r 1826
JULIA ANN 25 Oct'r 1828
PHILIP 17 Apr 1830
LYDIA 29 Jany 1832
NATHAN 3 Sept'r 1832
ISAAC 17 Jany 1833
RHODA 9 March 1833
LITTLETON 22 March 1833
HANNAH 9th January 1834
WELDON 28 Nov'r 1834
LUCY 23 Jany 1835
JACOB 29 Feby 1836
WILLIS 28 March 1838
PETER 25 May 1836
GODFREY called FERRA 25 July 1836
JANETT 30 July 1836
GEORGE 29 Dec'r 1836
CLAUD[?] 18 Feby 1837

******************

From the Will of GIDEON MACON, Granville Co, NC, Dec. 1761:
To my son NATHANIEL MACON two boys, and one girl:
GEORGE
BOBB
LUCY

[Bigtimber2]

I suspect after November mayors will crack down on protest until 2024 when the movement is needed again.


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[Roddie]

Roddie,

I'll stand by what I posted but after re-reading it, I do feel I need to add to it to make my point more clear. My original post was narrowly focused on the stereotypical depiction of physical cruelty and it was negligent to not address the deeper cruelty more explicitly. My intended point was that I find it hard to believe that slave owners woke up every morning, grabbed their whip and commenced to beating their slaves. I think that is the most common depiction of slavery in the antebellum days. That isn't how they would have treated their farm animals and it doesn't seem likely to me that they would have done that to their slaves. That is not to say that the treatment of slaves was kind. Quite the contrary. I was only addressing the purely physical aspect of beatings and chain yanking as shown in the protest link. I think that stereotypical depiction distracts and detracts for the real horror of slavery.

Slaves were considered and treated like animals. That is what allowed the owners to justify the institution. The bible even justifies it by giving "men" dominion over all animals. When humans deny other humans the fundamental recognition of their very humanity, it allows every aspect of freedom to be stripped from them. All it takes to justify slavery is to adjust your definition of "men".

When humans encounter another creature, they immediately evaluate how it can be used, with no regard to what the animal thinks. They don't consider its feelings or things like family bonds. When humans deny others the recognition of being human, they can justify and ignore the trauma of splitting families, of claiming ownership of their progeny and of taking away every aspect of self-determination. It is extremely paradoxical that a nation forged by the desire for individual freedom could have done this to other humans.

And we haven't learned our lesson. I was trying to make the point that we are still doing it. Our awareness of how we treat species of animals other than ourselves is only recently being addressed by what we call "animal rights whackos". If we ever have an encounter with creatures from another planet, will we try to use them for food, forced workers or pets? Are we going to narrow our definition of "sentient being" to justify another era of slavery?

Gotcha

[Woodiewacker82]

I have no idea how slaves were treated and I’m sure some of them were owned by people who treated them ok and some were owned by other who were cruel. But I will say this under no circumstances would I chose to be owned over being dead! Just think about being owned for a second and what that entails, would you like to be owned or to be viewed as merely a possession? There is no way you can explain it to me that I will see it as anything other than a horrible act! Give me freedom or give me death!

[Mars Bluff]

But I will say this under no circumstances would I chose to be owned over being dead! Just think about being owned for a second and what that entails, would you like to be owned or to be viewed as merely a possession? There is no way you can explain it to me that I will see it as anything other than a horrible act! Give me freedom or give me death!

Oh your ass IS owned. We all are. Free?

[Woodiewacker82]

Oh your ass IS owned. We all are. Free?

You don’t know what being owned is. I was owned for a few years and it’s not something I will ever be again.

[Bigtimber2]

There was physiological torture to keep slaves in line. No matter the time era there had to be something inside slaves owners to realize slavery is pure evil. The abolitionist realized as much and setup the underground railroads. Yet every time slavery is mention someone mentions that blacks sold slaves too like that makes it less evil or they not treat bad, denying liberty, freedom and pursuit of happiness to a human is evil unless there is just cause. Billions were made on the backs of slave labor the fallout has been tremendous.

I hate to see a general confederate monument taken down. Not for slave owners but general ones that represents the soldiers. There were many subsistent farmers in the Piedmont and Upstate that did not own slaves they only starting to make money with the invention of the cotton gin. They were fighting to defend their homeland in a war greedy bastards propelled them into. I doubt ******* would have pushed the issue until they wanted to expand their empire into Kansas. There was enough Jim Brown's growing bloodshed and civil unrest was coming. Some concerned over human rights but others concern of the mass amount of wealth the South was making. No way was slavery going to the Midwest too.

Any confederate symbol put up during Jim Crow and Segregation as a sign should come down. Most of us are pissed off to be told to wear a mask or close a boat ramp, now way in hell would sitting at the back of the bus work.

Now the pendulum is swinging way too far. Soon Francis Marion U will need to renamed. Having a Palmetto tree or live oak in your yard, racist. There has to be end. Humans are screwed up. Some of the greatest men have done more evil things. This is why idolatry statues, buildings and roads will always suck.


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[Calibogue]

There was physiological torture to keep slaves in line. No matter the time era there had to be something inside slaves owners to realize slavery is pure evil. The abolitionist realized as much and setup the underground railroads. Yet every time slavery is mention someone mentions that blacks sold slaves too like that makes it less evil or they not treat bad, denying liberty, freedom and pursuit of happiness to a human is evil unless there is just cause. Billions were made on the backs of slave labor the fallout has been tremendous.

I hate to see a general confederate monument taken down. Not for slave owners but general ones that represents the soldiers. There were many subsistent farmers in the Piedmont and Upstate that did not own slaves they only starting to make money with the invention of the cotton gin. They were fighting to defend their homeland in a war greedy bastards propelled them into. I doubt ******* would have pushed the issue until they wanted to expand their empire into Kansas. There was enough Jim Brown's growing bloodshed and civil unrest was coming. Some concerned over human rights but others concern of the mass amount of wealth the South was making. No way was slavery going to the Midwest too.

Any confederate symbol put up during Jim Crow and Segregation as a sign should come down. Most of us are pissed off to be told to wear a mask or close a boat ramp, now way in hell would sitting at the back of the bus work.

Now the pendulum is swinging way too far. Soon Francis Marion U will need to renamed. Having a Palmetto tree or live oak in your yard, racist. There has to be end. Humans are screwed up. Some of the greatest men have done more evil things. This is why idolatry statues, buildings and roads will always suck.


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Think of it in today's context.....Epstein kind of shit, kidnapping young children for sex kinda stuff today!
I swear, I can't imagine holding an innocent individual against their will like that, unfathomable....

[ecu1984]

it was wrong on every level and incomprehensible.

[flopduster]

Does this mean that everyone that buys 50 acres and names it “_________ plantation” will stop that shit?


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[MudCat05]

Roddie,

I'll stand by what I posted but after re-reading it, I do feel I need to add to it to make my point more clear. My original post was narrowly focused on the stereotypical depiction of physical cruelty and it was negligent to not address the deeper cruelty more explicitly. My intended point was that I find it hard to believe that slave owners woke up every morning, grabbed their whip and commenced to beating their slaves. I think that is the most common depiction of slavery in the antebellum days. That isn't how they would have treated their farm animals and it doesn't seem likely to me that they would have done that to their slaves. That is not to say that the treatment of slaves was kind. Quite the contrary. I was only addressing the purely physical aspect of beatings and chain yanking as shown in the protest link. I think that stereotypical depiction distracts and detracts for the real horror of slavery.

Slaves were considered and treated like animals. That is what allowed the owners to justify the institution. The bible even justifies it by giving "men" dominion over all animals. When humans deny other humans the fundamental recognition of their very humanity, it allows every aspect of freedom to be stripped from them. All it takes to justify slavery is to adjust your definition of "men".

When humans encounter another creature, they immediately evaluate how it can be used, with no regard to what the animal thinks. They don't consider its feelings or things like family bonds. When humans deny others the recognition of being human, they can justify and ignore the trauma of splitting families, of claiming ownership of their progeny and of taking away every aspect of self-determination. It is extremely paradoxical that a nation forged by the desire for individual freedom could have done this to other humans.

And we haven't learned our lesson. I was trying to make the point that we are still doing it. Our awareness of how we treat species of animals other than ourselves is only recently being addressed by what we call "animal rights whackos". If we ever have an encounter with creatures from another planet, will we try to use them for food, forced workers or pets? Are we going to narrow our definition of "sentient being" to justify another era of slavery?

Well that escalated quickly...

[wskinner]

Does this mean that everyone that buys 50 acres and names it “_________ plantation” will stop that shit?


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Merriam-Webster doesn’t say anything about slaves.

[BOGSTER]

Most slaves in South Carolina (and much of the south) worked on a task basis.

They had X to do for the day and when they finished they were done for the day and free to do what they pleased on the property.


This is well documented.

[Roddie]

Most slaves in South Carolina (and much of the south) worked on a task basis.

They had X to do for the day and when they finished they were done for the day and free to do what they pleased on the property.


This is well documented.

Link please?