Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 32 of 32

Thread: I think I prefer hams...

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Posts
    1,557

    Default

    just an observation,
    I have never seen any type of target with the bullseye being on a back ham.
    - maybe you should contact Glendel with your suggestion


    please post up their response!

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Columbia
    Posts
    7,047

    Default

    I have stuck an arrow in every inch of whitetail from their assholes to their adams apples. I have found most of them and lost some. I have found ham shot deer. I'd guess I've lost ham shot deer. I think the most ethical way to kill a whitetail with an arrow is to shoot him in the heart/lungs. I think some of what you are describing is folks being surprised that they found a deer on a "poor" hit, so they remember and tell the story. To the same point, people always remember the ones that they thought were pumphoused, that somehow got away. The perfectly shot ones that die on schedule aren't notable, and are thus forgotten.

    I also would argue with the point that the goal with an arrow is "acute blood loss", but thats another thread.
    Them that don't know him won't like him, and them that do sometimes won't know how to take him

    He ain't wrong, he's just different, and his pride won't let him do things to make you think he's right

    They don't put Championship rings on smooth hands

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    18,828

    Default

    The last three bucks I have shot have been in the neck and dropped in their tracks.
    If I see one in the morning, he will be shot in the lower neck or front shoulder depending on range and
    position.
    Last edited by ecu1984; 10-20-2019 at 10:14 AM.
    Meet Dick, Dick is a Climp5in fan...Ö..Don't be a Dick

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Gobbler's Knob, GA/ Bamberg,SC
    Posts
    14,884

    Default

    Back in the day, I shot a bunch with an arrow. I still feel that you need your target to be the area with the most margin for error. Things happen to arrows in flight sometimes and deer can react pretty damn quick to the sound of a bow ..

    Lung shot or tight and a little low behind the shoulder is my preferred aim point. Praying that you are going to cut the Femoral artery is risky business IMHO.
    F**K Cancer

    Just Damn.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    The Wild, Wild West
    Posts
    1,535

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by trkykilr View Post
    I have stuck an arrow in every inch of whitetail from their assholes to their adams apples. I have found most of them and lost some. I have found ham shot deer. I'd guess I've lost ham shot deer. I think the most ethical way to kill a whitetail with an arrow is to shoot him in the heart/lungs. I think some of what you are describing is folks being surprised that they found a deer on a "poor" hit, so they remember and tell the story. To the same point, people always remember the ones that they thought were pumphoused, that somehow got away. The perfectly shot ones that die on schedule aren't notable, and are thus forgotten.

    I also would argue with the point that the goal with an arrow is "acute blood loss", but thats another thread.
    Great points, and I was simplifying for the sake of getting the discussion started. You articulate the points that’s would punch huge holes in my argument had I claimed my evidence leads to bona-fide, proven results. There is no ethical way to conduct research on this in a manner that excludes the type of human nature bias you so accurately articulate, but I think the amount of information that’s out there warrants a serious effort to get some results that are as free of such bias as possible.

    Your second point...I understand what you are saying, but acute blood loss IS the PRIMARY GOAL. People are going for heart/lung and want a good blood trail to follow; you can lose a deer pretty easily that only runs 200 yards and does not leave a blood trail, and you can just as easily trail and find any deer that runs 3 miles and dies 24 hours later as long as you can find the next drop of blood. I understand that hemo-pneumothorax might actually be the physical factor that stops blood flow to brain and drops the deer, but blood loss is key to killing and finding the deer be it liver, lung, or heart shots.

    I’m bringing this up because as archery hunters, our primary goals regarding the actual “killing of an animal” part of why we hunt are to 1. kill the animal quickly and 2. Recover the animal before meat is lost to animals or spoilage. I think it was just assumed by most people getting into archery that heart/lung area was best kill zone to go for...maybe adapted from experience gun hunting, because major organs are there, and it seems to be the largest target with greatest margin for error. Ok, but... when a deer ducks a string by loading to run, the chest drops much more than the hips when it loads to bolt. Not only does it drop, often the deer will turn to blot in a different direction than he’s facing, and the belly forward is what moves the most when the deer twists to bolt. The back end is pretty much planted, as the deer will thrust with one leg or the other more or less to actually get moving in the direction his head neck and chest has moved toward. Simply put...when a deef reacts, which causes a high percentage of marginal hits, your aim point on the chest moves a lot vs how much your aim point on his ass end moves. When you consider the true kill zone of heat and lungs and how much of that can be covered up with shoulder bones...especially when a deer loads to run...it’s smaller than the kill zone on a ham shot. If you put one lung hits into the “non-lethal hit” category...the kill zone hit probability drops. Then throw in the trickiness of hunters misjudging slightly quartering away vs slightly quartering to. Put it all together...there seems to be way more that can go wrong with the traditional kill shot vs a split ham shot.

    Again, not scientific by any means, but I’d like to start collecting data and trying to get info as unbiased as possible to shed more light on this.

    Surely people do not forget screwing up and shooting a deer in the ham and losing that deer, right? So y’all ask the question when you can wherever you can get some answers. Let’s try to find as many hunters as possible who have arrows a deer in the ham and failed to recover the deer. I’ve asked this question before on a big archery forum, and I did not get one response saying a ham shot deer was lost. Of course, by page 2, the conversation had turned into a nasty bitch session about ethics.
    I tell you what, from "smoking a pair of big black dicks" to "wanking across the pond"...you have to be very careful when posting about duck hunting from a smartphone!

  6. #26
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    The Wild, Wild West
    Posts
    1,535

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nitro5x6's View Post
    Back in the day, I shot a bunch with an arrow. I still feel that you need your target to be the area with the most margin for error. Things happen to arrows in flight sometimes and deer can react pretty damn quick to the sound of a bow ..

    Lung shot or tight and a little low behind the shoulder is my preferred aim point. Praying that you are going to cut the Femoral artery is risky business IMHO.

    I know I’m a long read, but read the first post more closely. Some ham kills are due to femoral artery, no doubt, but most people are not hitting the femoral artery. Deer are bleeding out on ham shots due to the constant motion of the muscles and the enormous % of the deer’s cardiac output that flows to those big muscle groups inhibiting any significant clotting.
    I tell you what, from "smoking a pair of big black dicks" to "wanking across the pond"...you have to be very careful when posting about duck hunting from a smartphone!

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    The Crystal Coast
    Posts
    12,574

    Default

    Interesting thread.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2001
    Location
    Columbia, SC
    Posts
    34,209

    Default

    indeed

    who knew ECU would be a neck shooter....
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    10,546

    Default

    POD hunters prefer ham shots.

    I donít judge them at least they are not grown men using a rifle to kill a deer.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    The Wild, Wild West
    Posts
    1,535

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigtimber2 View Post
    POD hunters prefer ham shots.

    I don’t judge them at least they are not grown men using a rifle to kill a deer.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I always wondered about powdered succinylcholine actually getting in the bloodstream and working. Maybe the ham shot is what killed the deer so quickly and the pods had nothing to very little to do with it.
    I tell you what, from "smoking a pair of big black dicks" to "wanking across the pond"...you have to be very careful when posting about duck hunting from a smartphone!

  11. #31
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    The Wild, Wild West
    Posts
    1,535

    Default

    We have a new general surgery group at our hospital, and The third of the three was at work this am. We talked work a bit before devolving into a bowhunting discussion. About ten minutes into ya telling each other about our hunting evolutions, he tells me completely unsolicited, ďyeah, Iíve got a good friend who shoots traditional lights out; he started waiting and aiming for the femoral artery about four years ago, and heís not missed hitting that artery and dropping his deer/elk/antelope within sight since he started that 4 years ago.Ē

    No shit! I tell him about this thread and my theory on him probably not hitting the FA on all those shots but more likely just massive blood loss due to cardiac output to those muscles. He paused and said, ďthatís a good point...heís good, but I doubt heís that good.Ē Me either. Anyway, thought it was pretty interesting that he threw that out there as an extension story while we were just discussing accuracy and/or lack thereof.
    I tell you what, from "smoking a pair of big black dicks" to "wanking across the pond"...you have to be very careful when posting about duck hunting from a smartphone!

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    On the road about 250 days a year
    Posts
    3,337

    Default

    I have shot two deer in the ham with 2 different results.

    I shot a mule deer that was bedded quartering away hard at 63 yards. I missed my target a few inches and hit the deer between the ham and the backstrap with a Rage. The deer ran 100 yards and died.

    I did not recover my other deer shot in the ham. I was in Illinois in a stand and the wind was gusting 30-40mph. My tree stand was whipping back and forth. A 135Ē buck ran directly under my stand on a field edge. He stopped at 25 yards quartering away. The wind carried the arrow away from my target and hit the deer directly in the ham. The deer ran out of the field and crossed a deep creek. Having a lighted knock, I saw where he dropped the arrow. The deer stopped at 70 yards looking to where I shot him. He stood still for 5 minutes bleeding the entire time. I could see the leaves covered in blood wirh my binos. After the 5 minutes, he saw a doe and he ran into an adjacent field and I watching him chase does for 15 minutes with a bloody ham. The same deer was spotted the next morning chasing does.

    My arrow got about 5Ē of penetration before it fell out when he crossed the creek. Iím guessing a hip shot has a higher percentage of recovery with a 2 bladed broadhead then it did with my mechanical head.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    "I do not hunt turkeys because I want to, I hunt them because I have to. I would really rather not do it, but I am helpless in the grip of my compulsion"
    - Tom Kelly, Tenth Legion, 1973

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •