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Thread: SCDNR Turkey survey

  1. #41
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    Once again....turkeys are very, very complex birds socially.
    There may or may not be correlations no one yet understand.
    Unless the questions are asked and we look at ALL possibilities of population decline we will never figure it out.
    There is potentially so much more going on biologically than most on here could ever comprehend!
    Expect more surveys and be a part of the solution to figure it out....
    \"I never saw a wild thing feel sorry for itself. A small bird will drop dead frozen from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.\" <br />D.H. LAWRENCE

  2. #42
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    Maybe we should just close turkey season to give them a chance.


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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbenn454 View Post
    I think the results will be more interesting than pertinent. It'd be nice to know how the peons hunt instead of the sub gauge, tss shooting, trumpet sucking elitist echo chamber of scducks.
    Laws should only be made only if the population cannot sustain/maintain itself, which would probably lead to a limit reduction not an outlawing of a certain style of hunting. I don't think asking people what gauge, pellet material, decoy preference or opinion on decoys is going to show that reaping or male turkey decoys account for too many dead turkeys.
    Well if you base turkey hunting on what you see on TV then 99% of the public uses reaping/strutters. That seems to be the perception while probably less than 50% actually do. The die hard turkey hunters here probably use those tactics far less than the 50%. Die hard turkey hunters probably do more for the resource in a multitude of avenues than the general public. May look like an elitist group or be warranted, still doesn't change the facts.
    Worship the LORD, not HIS creation.

  4. #44
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    while i agree to some extent, spur, a dead turkey doesnt know if you shot him or Ben Lee did.

    i tend to side w dbenn. I live and let live when it comes to HOW you kill a turkey and agree the DNRs job is to make laws that control the population for continued hunting success. TSS, reaping, strutters, fancy sights, etc be damned.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbenn454 View Post
    I think the results will be more interesting than pertinent. It'd be nice to know how the peons hunt instead of the sub gauge, tss shooting, trumpet sucking elitist echo chamber of scducks.
    Laws should only be made only if the population cannot sustain/maintain itself, which would probably lead to a limit reduction not an outlawing of a certain style of hunting. I don't think asking people what gauge, pellet material, decoy preference or opinion on decoys is going to show that reaping or male turkey decoys account for too many dead turkeys.
    Concerning the guns and ammo questions, they are primarily wanting to see if this data could be used to educate hunters on ethical ranges of the new ammo technologies and trends towards smaller gauges. The hunting/ammo industry hasnít done a good job of educating consumers on how to properly pattern TSS concerning ethical ranges. Using this data in correlation with the wounded bird data may help the cause.

    Can TSS kill turkeys at 70 yards +? Absolutely, with the right choke and set up, but how many average hunters know their pellet count at various ranges and what # of pellets is an ethical killing pattern? What percentage of turkeys are killed at longer distances once unheard of? Have I personally killed turkeys at ranges with TSS that I would have missed or wounded turkeys 15 years ago with lead ammo? Absolutely.

    A possible outcome of this data could be that state agencies use this information to partner with ammo/gun companies on further educating consumers on ethical ranges of pellet type and ranges in relation to the gauge you are shooting.

    With the addition of strutting decoys, blinds, fans, after market chokes and ammo like TSS are todayís average hunter more effective on average at killing birds than we were 25 years ago?


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    "I do not hunt turkeys because I want to, I hunt them because I have to. I would really rather not do it, but I am helpless in the grip of my compulsion"
    - Tom Kelly, Tenth Legion, 1973

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by HartClemson99 View Post
    With the addition of strutting decoys, blinds, fans, after market chokes and ammo like TSS are today’s average hunter more effective on average at killing birds than we were 25 years ago?
    Absolutely
    Member of the Tenth Legion Since 2004

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by HartClemson99 View Post
    Concerning the guns and ammo questions, they are primarily wanting to see if this data could be used to educate hunters on ethical ranges of the new ammo technologies and trends towards smaller gauges. The hunting/ammo industry hasn’t done a good job of educating consumers on how to properly pattern TSS concerning ethical ranges. Using this data in correlation with the wounded bird data may help the cause.

    Can TSS kill turkeys at 70 yards +? Absolutely, with the right choke and set up, but how many average hunters know their pellet count at various ranges and what # of pellets is an ethical killing pattern? What percentage of turkeys are killed at longer distances once unheard of? Have I personally killed turkeys at ranges with TSS that I would have missed or wounded turkeys 15 years ago with lead ammo? Absolutely.

    A possible outcome of this data could be that state agencies use this information to partner with ammo/gun companies on further educating consumers on ethical ranges of pellet type and ranges in relation to the gauge you are shooting.

    With the addition of strutting decoys, blinds, fans, after market chokes and ammo like TSS are today’s average hunter more effective on average at killing birds than we were 25 years ago?


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    TSS saying it can kill at 70 yards sells shells. Not too many people want to pay $7 a shell to have a really dead turkey at 20 yards vs $2 a shell for a dead turkey at 20 yards. An no I'm not saying that all or most people buying TSS did so that they could shoot turkeys at stupid distances. I'm saying that's part of their marketing and it would be an uphill battle to change the perception.

    John answers the survey saying he hunted 15 days and killed 3 turkeys. He also answered that he rarely uses decoys. How many turkeys did John kill with the aid of a decoy? Maybe 0, maybe 3, that was my whole problem with how those particular questions were worded. I would have liked to see them a little more specific as to how many were killed with the use of a decoy, because that could show a trend of an advantage... Even if it did I don't care how other people hunt turkeys and don't want a law about it.

  8. #48
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    i agree, dbenn.

    and I agree we are more effecient killers with our weaponry. the limit should adjust for that. dont tell me how to hunt.

    I dont own an TSS and dont think it will make me less of an asshole if I bought some. I get ten shells per box and dont pattern my shotgun or miss a lot so they should last me 3-4 years.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spur hunter View Post
    Well if you base turkey hunting on what you see on TV then 99% of the public uses reaping/strutters. That seems to be the perception while probably less than 50% actually do. The die hard turkey hunters here probably use those tactics far less than the 50%. Die hard turkey hunters probably do more for the resource in a multitude of avenues than the general public. May look like an elitist group or be warranted, still doesn't change the facts.
    I know die hard turkey hunters do a lot for turkeys. I just don't like the attitude of superiority due to a certain way they hunt. It's also fun because it's guaranteed to get a rise out of them. I share a few traits of hunting styles with the elitists, however I don't base my decision on my superior morals but base it on the fact I think it betters my chances.

    I'm no poet and if turkeys went extinct I'd be just fine. I'd just go bass fishing more. I don't really care for anymore laws in the woods.

  10. #50
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    If the DNR provides sound data to and a solid recommendation to the General Asssembly it will take 20 years to pass a bill.
    Last edited by Bigtimber2; 06-13-2018 at 02:22 PM.

  11. #51
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    I said die hard turkey hunters. You fellas said elitist and poet.

    When someone asks for opinions here, which is most often the case when folks say what they do turkey hunting etc., then one ought not to get riled over the answer they get. Take the rifle for turkey thread recently where the op asked for opinions, some gave theirs and it peeved some off. That's where I think all this "morals" jazz is being dug up. Beyond that it's just the usual hazing.

    I just took the survey. Mine had far less questions than what I've seen here. Not sure what's up with that but I can only suspect not everyone is getting the same survey or else some answers drive different questions or amounts of them to come up based on your answers. Either way, I got the questions on reaping, strutters etc. and answered them. Also got a question asking did I take other novice hunters this season. All yall that hunted with me this year just got classified as novices. LOL
    Worship the LORD, not HIS creation.

  12. #52
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    And as far as how you kill a turkey, well it's all about the harvest. If you see a trend of more efficient harvesting then you will see more restricted limits. Any restrictions on weaponry have been for safety or some effort to protect other wildlife not in season at the time.
    Worship the LORD, not HIS creation.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbenn454 View Post
    I know die hard turkey hunters do a lot for turkeys. I just don't like the attitude of superiority due to a certain way they hunt. It's also fun because it's guaranteed to get a rise out of them. I share a few traits of hunting styles with the elitists, however I don't base my decision on my superior morals but base it on the fact I think it betters my chances.

    I'm no poet and if turkeys went extinct I'd be just fine. I'd just go bass fishing more. I don't really care for anymore laws in the woods.
    I agree with everything you said except for the bass fishing part and extinct turkeys.

    You can sure tell turkey season is out. I can't wait wait until next year, hope to get my first one!

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sportin' Woodies View Post
    I'm a pretty big fan of fewer laws.

    Y'all are comfortable with having to notify the fucking government that you killed a turkey?
    There used to be mandatory check-ins, but people were so inconvenienced by having to go to a check station that they became antiquated and the data of little use since compliance was so low. Faster and easier is what people are wanting and this would make it easier for people to report and feel somewhat confident in the results, especially given how poorly the average person understands how surveys work.

  15. #55
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    I am of the opinion that innovations such as blinds, motorized and more realistic decoys, advanced optics, etc have increased hunter efficiency.
    The increase in hunter efficiency is such that places with less than optimal habitat, birds cannot maintain recruitment at a sustainable level.
    Areas with above average habitat are not having issues maintaining adequate recruitment.

    Of course, there are other factors such as predation (most of which is at the nest level and thus reverts right back to sub-par habitat).....Then there is the whole social aspect of turkeys and the complexity of their relationships and dayum who knows what will be determined with all the ongoing research out there!

    I have said it before and will do so again but.....Most of the country has only been hunting turkeys for what, 30 years or less?
    That's not very long to learn all there is about management of such a complex and social game species.
    There is much to learn so work with DNR on surveys, check-ins, etc....Be part of the solution!
    Last edited by Calibogue; 06-13-2018 at 05:47 PM.
    \"I never saw a wild thing feel sorry for itself. A small bird will drop dead frozen from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.\" <br />D.H. LAWRENCE

  16. #56
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    No doubt.

    I wish I could breathe life back in him, if I could I'd hunt him again tomorrow. - Ben Rodgers Lee

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  17. #57
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    [QUOTE=Calibogue;2490488]I am of the opinion that innovations such as blinds, motorized and more realistic decoys, advanced optics, etc have increased hunter efficiency.
    The increase in hunter efficiency is such that places with less than optimal habitat cannot maintain recruitment at a sustainable level.
    Areas with above average habitat are not having issues maintaining adequate recruitment.

    Of course, there are other factors such as predation (most of which is at the nest level and thus reverts right back to sub-par habitat).....Then there is the whole social aspect of turkeys and the complexity of their relationships and dayum who knows what will be determined with all the ongoing research out there!

    I have said it before and will do so again but.....Most of the country has only been hunting turkeys for what, 30 years or less?
    That's not very long to learn all there is about game management of such a complex game species.
    There is much to learn so work with DNR on surveys, check-ins, etc....[/QUOTE

    Well said!
    "I do not hunt turkeys because I want to, I hunt them because I have to. I would really rather not do it, but I am helpless in the grip of my compulsion"
    - Tom Kelly, Tenth Legion, 1973

  18. #58
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    I'm aware there used to be check stations. I used to check birds that were killed in the morning but was forced to break the law on evening birds.

    Alcohol used to be illegal too.

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sportin' Woodies View Post
    I'm aware there used to be check stations. I used to check birds that were killed in the morning but was forced to break the law on evening birds.

    Alcohol used to be illegal too.
    \"I never saw a wild thing feel sorry for itself. A small bird will drop dead frozen from a bough without ever having felt sorry for itself.\" <br />D.H. LAWRENCE

  20. #60
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    Haha

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