Concerns/questions for 2/15 meeting

[Catdaddy]

Originally posted by Venator:

Catdaddy, I would rather cut the limit on mallards back to at most 2 per man. I don't care if they are the most plentiful duck in the rest of the country, they are not plentiful HERE. With so few migrating here now I can't believe anyone concerned with their welfare would want the limit set at 4.

What you don't realize is we are only averaging .14 mallards per person per hunt. Cutting it from 4 to 2 will have NO effect. Cutting it to one will have NO effect.

Let's look at the numbers from our wma's. I think you would agree that that is a better place to duck hunt than the average place in SC.

After 8 hunts the total kill on wild mallards was 180 mallards.

There were 1261 hunters on the 8 hunts

That's .14 mallards per hunter per hunt.


I'll say this slowly for you.

IT TAKES AN AVERAGE OF 7 DAYS OF HUNTING FOR ONE PERSON TO KILL ONE WILD MALLARD on a WMA property.


The only effective way to reduce the harvest in SC is close the season......period......cutting the limit here will have no effect.


Not even the most qualified biologists would recommend reducing harvest here on the most plentiful duck in the country by closing the season. We(in SC) amount to a gnat on an elephants ass in the grand scheme of things in the world of waterfowling.


The answer lies above us.

[Venator]

Why the nasty tone Catdaddy? You're a little too old for that aren't you? You seem to take it as a personal affront when someone dares to disagree with you. This is a message board where people post their opinions and not everyone is going to always agree with your own. You do not have to say anything slow for me and I am quite capable of understanding your attempt to make a point without your being condescending.

Now, back to the matter at hand. There are far more mallards killed here in impoundments and beaver ponds than some realize. Hip surveys and state harvest numbers are hogwash. Look at some of the pictures on here and you will see men killing far more than .14 mallards a hunt. The number of mallards taken per hunter on WMA draw hunts is not germane to this discussion. Well managed private properties are holding more mallards here than all the S.C. WMAs and NWRs combined. They are also killing more mallards than the public draw hunters.

It's true that I would love to see mallards taken out of the bag altogether but that is unrealistic. Again, the issue is not whether mallards are plentiful in the rest of the country but if they they plentiful HERE. The answer to that question is obvious. Why not protect the few remaining migratory mallards that make it to S.C.? Would you shoot the last Canadian mallard imprinted to S.C. simply because they are plentiful in the REST of the country? I don't understand that type of thinking.

[Sasha and Abby]

We can close the season for a hundred years, but if it does not get locked up-freezing-assed-cold above us for a week, we will not see any migrators to amount to anything here. You think we have lots of corn ponds here... You should see what is above us. From NC. all the way to upper NY. state, there are corn ponds beyond your wildest imaginations. That, along with "no-till" agricultural practices, will keep the birds well fed and happy.

In other words, there is no reason for the birds to come all the way to SC. anymore if they do not HAVE to. They have plenty of food, and have plenty of water - most years.

Many years ago, the birds ate their way down the Atlantic flyway. When they ran out of food, or when water locked up, they went South. When you take both of these varibles out of the equation, the birds will opt to take the lazy way out, and stay where they are.

Don't blame AHM practices for the lack of migrators in SC. It is not their fault.

[Venator]

AHM should be thoroughly investigated, if not outright abandoned but I am not blaming it on our lack of mallards. Certainly the issues you raise are ALL contributing factors for our mallard woes. What I am saying is that it is vitally important to protect the few remaining migrators we DO have. Thankfully, we have a few dedicated waterfowl managers in this state who are more concerned with helping ducks than hunting ducks. But then we are back to Duck Tape's question and it doesn't look like many here are willing to answer it.

[woodhorse]

Nab,
Exactly what meeting is this for? Just curious.

[Catdaddy]

Shazaaaaaaaaaaaam,

If you read Trigger's post you will see references to studies on pressure.

Here's part of it;

Pressure

"Recent research shows ducks react rapidly to hunting pressure. After just one weekend of being shot at, veterans of the flyway change their habits, typically spending their days far from hunting areas, venturing into marshes with rich food supplies only after nightfall when hunting is not allowed. "


Now Venator,

If they can be pressured so much they will wait until darkness to move, please tell us one more time why afternoon closures,did/will not work.

They will work and I think you know it. IMHO,you are in denial and have the attitude of so many of the SC hunters.

"Do something to get the ducks back....do anything.........well, as long as it doesn't effect me."


As far as afternoon closures, I have spanked em plenty of times as you and the others have on weather fronts. It's not just a coastal thing and you would not be the only one giving up something.

[Venator]

What am I denying and what attitude do I possess?I would be giving up practically nothing with a noon closure, Catdaddy, because I am not shooting my ponds to begin with. I can count on one hand the number of times in the last 10 years I have shot after noon and that includes invites to other places. Your proposed scheme will not affect me in any way so I am not sure what you're implying. You see, to me it doesn't matter if you kill the last Ontario mallard in S.C. at daybreak or at 3:30. Once they are gone they are gone.

[Boom Boom]

Look at pusspop getting nasty. If public or private land managers won't to have noon closure then fine let them. But don't make the mistake of thinking we won't fight our ass off from letting YOU cut our season in half for some hairbrain scheme. There is no evidence that noon closure helped anything anywhere. Comparing 30,000 ducks at Hollowell rest area to all of South Carolina is ridiculous. I am sure you have sat your hiney right there in Arkansas and seen some ducks catdaddy but 30,000 ducks ain't doodly to that place anyway. It isn't even doodly to several places in SC just a few years ago. We need to concentrate our efforts on things that might work to get ducks coming. Not waste our time on local bullcrap that hasn't even worked in the past. With the few ducks we get I will be hunting them as the weather dictates between X day and Y day. What time of day during the season I hunt them just ain't none of your business.

[Catdaddy]

Boom Boom,

If you go back and read you will see I stated that .........ducks moving around in the afternoon may or may not be a good thing. That point would need to be debated.

What you and a few others here are trying to deny is that ducks will move around freely when they know they aren't going to be bothered.........whether it's in the afternoon,after dark, or after the season.

How do you know it didn't work in the past? The Santee experiment didn't work because the private land owners could shoot in the pm..........and alot of them did. They ran their ducks off at the best time ,when no one else could kill one. I'm sure that's the basis for your strong comments.........unless you just like roost shooting.

You remind me of the attitude in Mergie's post" NIMP" (Not in My Playground). You might want to read it, it fits you like a glove.

[SC quacker]

Originally posted by Boom Boom:
Look at pusspop getting nasty. If public or private land managers won't to have noon closure then fine let them. But don't make the mistake of thinking we won't fight our ass off from letting YOU cut our season in half for some hairbrain scheme. There is no evidence that noon closure helped anything anywhere. Comparing 30,000 ducks at Hollowell rest area to all of South Carolina is ridiculous. I am sure you have sat your hiney right there in Arkansas and seen some ducks catdaddy but 30,000 ducks ain't doodly to that place anyway. It isn't even doodly to several places in SC just a few years ago. We need to concentrate our efforts on things that might work to get ducks coming. Not waste our time on local bullcrap that hasn't even worked in the past. With the few ducks we get I will be hunting them as the weather dictates between X day and Y day. What time of day during the season I hunt them just ain't none of your business.

Now that sounds like a roost shooter with a bad attitude.

[TurkeyKiller]

Everyone needs to get off this roost shooting is the problem. That is the least of our problems here in SC. It's all about the flyway, and my honest opinion is that no matter how hard we try there is only little we can do here in SC to change things. Our flyway has changed so much in the past 30 years. Growth rate(industrial, residental) of our flyway has grown so much since the "good ole' days of the 70's". Areas up north where the ducks would group up before their trips down here are rapidly dissappearing. I believe ducks love to take the easiest route down, and I don't think our flyway is the best. So if we stop hunting all together, I don't believe our duck population would grow to a point of greatness. Also, the hell w/ whoever wants only morning hunting. Every problem you say that afternoon hunting is causing is very easily corrected. If hunters will be ethical there won't be a problem out there. The only true argument you have for closing afternoon hunting is so it will make it easier for DNR to patrol. Do you think it is accidental that they are trying to close dove hunting in the morning and duck hunting in the evening? One more thing; whoever said "hunting in the evening is okay if you are east of 17" do you not think the tides affect us here in Berkeley co. and all along the lowcountry?

[Boom Boom]

Screw the tides. So it is okay if the lowcountry hunters have a good tide to hunt but it is not okay if the upcountry hunters have a good frontal boundry to hunt? Screw that. If we are going to cut our season in half then make it a 25 day season starting in January not a 50 half day season starting in November. That is what is BS.

[skydawg]

Even if you shut it off at noon, pressure is still gonna be there with 4 rubberneckers piled up in a boat looking for a new place to hunt... I would be all for it, but it aint gonna cure the pressure problem, Nor is is going to bring more ducks our way. I say cut the limit to one duck a day, then see who real hunters are....who will actually go out at 4 am for one duck.... im game..make my shell cost less, and i wouldnt need a benelli...

[Low Country Sandlapper]

Exactly, Skydog. Noon closure will accomplish very little, if anything. I will fight it tooth and nail.

Duck Tape did raise an excellent question...

[dukmon]