3 1/2 vs 3 in

[skyduck]

Did it to a 391 for the ex and she noticed a big difference.

[Duckman#1]

Lengthened Forcing Cone
Benefits: Improves shot pattern and reduces felt recoil. By gradually tapering the sharp angle between the chamber and the bore of a shotgun barrel, a lengthened forcing cone creates a smoother path for the shot charge while at the same time reducing the barrel resistance that contributes to recoil.

[Gander]

Do what you want with the bore, forcing cone or whatever. Recoil is generated by the force generated behind the shot charge. The gasses expand and is resited by the weight of the shot charge. So you have to reduce either the charge or the payload. Unless you agree that by lengthening the forcing cone you lose velocity, it ain't happening. If you increase the weight of the gun, you can reduce the amount of felt recoil.

[Duckman#1]

Reduce the resistence of the shot and wad being pushed past the ridge of a standard forcing cone will reduce recoil. This from the mouth of a pro at Ballistic Specielties. I'll take his word over yours! No one is saying it will take away ALL recoil.

[Gander]

By lengthening the cone, you haven't changed the amount of resistence, only the time it takes to transition to the bore. This time is hardly perceptable by the shooter. I quit listening to guys that are trying to sell services. You don't see too many guns tricked out by them anymore among clay shooters. During my travels shooting tournaments I get the opportunity to talk with a few experts in the field of ballistics and they all seem to agree that recoil is hard to overcome without reducing velocity or payload. There are things you can do to ease it, with shock absorbing giszmos.

[Duckman#1]

you haven't changed the amount of resistence,

Thats where your wrong! Take a "stock" barrel and a barrel that has had the cones worked and look down them and then tell me your not reducing resistence. FORCING CONE: Forcing something from one diameter bore to a SMALLER bore.Does and will increase friction! No way it can't!! I guess back boring is a waist of time too!?

[Gander]

I guess back boring is a waist of time too!?

You got it. The wads now produced are made flexible enough that they will seal properly in all bore sizes, which in reality don’t vary by any large margin. The smallest Italian bores are .721 and the largest being the Mossberg at .775. With the gasses driving the wad and the shot resisting the acceleration, the wad is forced outward. Friction remains the same. If the bore is large enough that gasses are escaping, you will lose velocity. So it goes back to what I have been saying all along. If you reduce velocity or reduce the payload, you can reduce recoil. In fact by backboring a gun, you actually reduce the weight of the barrels, so in reality you will actually increase the amount of recoil felt by the shooter. The gun that loosened more of my fillings was a Mossberg 835 with overbored barrels. Heck the damn thing was even ported, so not only did it kick like a Missouri mule, the thing just begs for a hearing aid. Porting may be the best attempt at reducing recoil, but you first have to admit that you lose velocity with those gasses escaping out of those little holes. I haven’t heard that you will lose velocity with porting, so I have to assume it’s worthless as well. In my opinion they are all marketing gimmicks, designed to separate you from your money.

[Gander]

By the way, if you think relieving forcing cones reduces recoil, then the same theory should apply with long extended chokes too.

[Duckman#1]

By the way, if you think relieving forcing cones reduces recoil, then the same theory should apply with long extended chokes too.

Now that you've thrown that out there enlighten us with your theory why.

In my opinion all extended chokes are the same unless you buy a wad stopping choke which in theory and on paper makes sense, Or you buy an extended choke that is ported to reduce muzzle jump.

[Gander]

Generally, the flush mount chokes you get with most gun offer very short taper in the choke section. Extended chokes offer a more gradual taper. That would in effect mimic what short cones vs long cones do. I do in fact get better patterns with these extended chokes. However, I don’t think it reduces recoil one bit. By the way, if the porting is all the way around, I don’t think you will get less muzzle jump. Only if the porting is on the up side will you benefit from less muzzle rise.

[Duckman#1]

gradual taper </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />

very short taper </font>[/QUOTE]Key word TAPER. There is nothing gradual about a unworked cone if you look in your barrel.It's a well defines lip that a shot charge being crunched through is added friction.Simple physics

[DemsRstupid]

I have a Remington 11-87 supermag that works flawlessly with 3.5in shells. I also have a Mossberg 835 3.5in pump, and the difference in recoil is probably 30% less than the pump. There is definitely more shot delivered on target, especially if you invest in a good choke tube. Also, Remington will save you about 400 compared to a browning and 500 compared to a Benelli. By the way, it jams like a bithch with light field loads. dont bother taking it to the dove field unless you like shooting $8 a box high brass shells at doves. Still a good gun for what it is designed for.

[skyduck]

No holes in any of my barrels. I'm not up all on the scientific crap I just know that the forcing cone deal made a big difference with the former wifes gun. I won't argue at all about the payload stuff. I started her on 7/8 oz 12 ga loads and worked her up to 1 oz later. Even with the 7/8 stuff it wasn't until we had the cones lenthened that she could go 100 without getting beat up. And yes the gun "fit" her correctly. Believe what you want, but when dealing with women shooting recoil is a big deal. If she said it helped it was well worth the $40 plus shipping.

[Gander]

Ahhh, the mind is a powerful thing. For all you doubters, here is a link that puts all those barrel modifications to rest. Read it, learn it, live it, love it. Anyone who knows the technoid, knows he is an authority on shotgun ballistics. Note the items factored in to calculate recoil. It does not take into account barrel specifications. Enjoy.

http://www.shotgunreport.com/TechTec...19-Dec-04.html

[CPiper]

Originally posted by skyduck:
No holes in any of my barrels.

[img]graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
What kind of gun do you shoot??

ALL of my guns have holes in the barrel!!
[img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[Duckman#1]

[QUOTE] [The formula does not take into account any possible recoil reduction due to
overboring, long cones or porting. /QUOTE]


Read it and weap there gun guru boy! This was straight from your know it all so it must be true!!! Maybe you should have read it your self!

[Gander]

Still a true statement. The formula for calculating recoil does not take into account barrel modifications. What the Technoid stated is exactly what I have said all along. Unless you accept the fact that you are losing velocity all those gimicks are pure folley. But hey, it's your dough, do what you want. I live with recoil to the tune of about 20,000 rounds a year, if there was a magic bullet I was have done it all. In the end I have decided to reduce payload. I just received an order of 5,000 shells and they are all 1 ouncers.

[Duckman#1]

Unless you accept the fact that you are losing velocity all those gimicks are pure folley.

Just like you Briley choke throughs the same pattern as the chokes sold at Wal Mart. Never said a word about loosing or not loosing velocity! And I'll bet the velocity lost by "blow by" is not less then the velocity lost from friction of a stock forcing cone. I shoot 3 cases a year of 3.5 #2 with 1 9/16 oz so whats you point?? Number of shells shot means diddle to this discussion, You still shoot them one at a time!

[Wing Nut]

My next gun will go to Seminole, they do a 5" FC. That SOB ought to kick like a .410, with 1 3/4 oz shot in a 3.5 .

[skyduck]

I think your expectations are a little high Hilbilly, but I believe you will notice a difference. Let us know.