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Thread: will the real paleo please stand up

  1. #1
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    Default will the real paleo please stand up

    http://nutritionfacts.org/2014/09/23...24494-23499121

    you know I love to argue. I am a BIG fan of CROSSFIT. I think that is the key to many of y'alls success. I applaud you. However, I have begun to study diet and have some MINOR issues with the whole "paleo" thing. This is an interesting article on diet. From what I have read, a plant based diet (vegan) is most likely to be the best overall in terms of decreasing chronic diseases and cancer. Granted, I know I cant live like that, so a modified paleo/vegan diet is more in my wheelhouse. I'm gonna eat meat but not as the focal point of a meal. I'm gonna eat sugar, but its damn sure gonna be something I limit. The whole grains are on my watch list, but I will still eat them. I think we are finding more ways to include certains grains without any issues.

    discuss...
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

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    From a biochemical and nutritional stand point, you need protein. You need fats; animal fats. And you need cholesterol. Your brain cannot function without it. The system that is our body was designed to run on meat and fat and some carbs. Take away the grocery stores and the readily available access to non seasonal fruits and vegetables. If you broke your diet down to only eating what was seasonally available you would basically starve to death in the winter and early spring by following a vegan diet. Shit just ain't natural. In order to survive you will have to have a diet that consist of mostly protein and fats from animals. I'm certainly not suggesting you toss out your refrigerator and go all completely native. But our species survived and thrived on a seasonal diet of plants and a year round diet of meat and animal based fats.
    Last edited by Glenn; 09-30-2014 at 07:49 AM.

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    I agree, Glenn, to some degree. The article talks about the differences in today's meats. That is something we all need to be aware of. I wish we could do away with hormones and such.

    my brother is way big into this. he has a couple of sayings that make a lot of sense if you can think of them when you are at the store or planning a meal.

    East fresh foods grown closer to home.
    Dont eat anything in a package.
    Dont eat anything that doesnt spoil.
    Make the vegetables the centerpiece of the meal, not the meat.
    Dont eat sugar.

    if you can do that, you will be fine. Diet PLUS exercise is the key, though.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

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    The major problem with the Paleo Diet is not the diet, it is US. Our society is not set up to live truly paleo. We built this diet around the ideals of what a cave man might do, but none of us actually live it. I don't spend all day looking for food, I walk to the fridge. I don't eat the organ meat, I grab the ribeye or ground beef and slap it on the grill. How many of us kill a deer and eat the tongue that night as a special treat? There is no fundamental problem with the paleo diet, it works, our ancestors are proof of that, the fact that we have survived as a species is proof. It is the evolution of society and technology that is wrong.
    "This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you." John 15:12

    "Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord." Hebrews 12:14

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    I agree, Glenn, to some degree. The article talks about the differences in today's meats. That is something we all need to be aware of. I wish we could do away with hormones and such.

    my brother is way big into this. he has a couple of sayings that make a lot of sense if you can think of them when you are at the store or planning a meal.

    East fresh foods grown closer to home.
    Dont eat anything in a package.
    Dont eat anything that doesnt spoil.
    Make the vegetables the centerpiece of the meal, not the meat.
    Dont eat sugar.

    if you can do that, you will be fine. Diet PLUS exercise is the key, though.
    That highlighted part is huge. Our store bought meat isn't free grazed and pastured. It's penned up and grain fed to increase fat. Different stuff for sure. Grass fed is a much better option but I have a hard time paying more for a product that cost less to raise. Seems like if you're bypassing the feedlot then it shouldn't cost as much and dang sure shouldn't cost more.

    Quote Originally Posted by MolliesMaster View Post
    The major problem with the Paleo Diet is not the diet, it is US. Our society is not set up to live truly paleo. We built this diet around the ideals of what a cave man might do, but none of us actually live it. I don't spend all day looking for food, I walk to the fridge. I don't eat the organ meat, I grab the ribeye or ground beef and slap it on the grill. How many of us kill a deer and eat the tongue that night as a special treat? There is no fundamental problem with the paleo diet, it works, our ancestors are proof of that, the fact that we have survived as a species is proof. It is the evolution of society and technology that is wrong.
    I agree and what you're saying ties in with what I posted above. I don't think I've ever been hungry enough to want deer tongue or heart. But I'd eat it if I had to.

    And show me any native of the North American continent that had steady access to bananas and butternut squash in November. Hell anytime.
    Last edited by Glenn; 09-30-2014 at 08:16 AM.

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    This is where I think the paleo diet falters. Granted, you're copying a diet from a people that lived to thirty years of age but you cant put the same amount of TODAYS meat on the plate and think you are eating the same thing that your ancestors did.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

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    Glenn, since you brought up heart.

    I actually took the time to make duck heart and liver fajitas last year, and it was surprisingly one of the best things I ever ate. I even tricked my father and girl friend into thinking it was ordinary duck breast and not organ meat. (PS- I think the idea came from someone on here)

    I think I might actually try the deer heart this year. Tongue is gonna take a while.
    "This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you." John 15:12

    "Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord." Hebrews 12:14

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    This is where I think the paleo diet falters. Granted, you're copying a diet from a people that lived to thirty years of age but you cant put the same amount of TODAYS meat on the plate and think you are eating the same thing that your ancestors did.
    Dude. You're a smart cat. So please stop it with the "30 yr life span" nonsense. You know as well as I do that number came from infant mortality rates and had absolutely nothing to do with diet.

  9. #9
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    numbers dont lie.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

  10. #10
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    Statistics fabricator.

    I should have expected such from a dentite.

    And here I was agreeing with you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    I wish we could do away with hormones and such.
    You're an intelligent person...don't start this "hormones in my meat" crap.


    Quote Originally Posted by MolliesMaster View Post
    Glenn, since you brought up heart.

    I actually took the time to make duck heart and liver fajitas last year, and it was surprisingly one of the best things I ever ate. I even tricked my father and girl friend into thinking it was ordinary duck breast and not organ meat. (PS- I think the idea came from someone on here)

    I think I might actually try the deer heart this year. Tongue is gonna take a while.
    You're welcome.
    Man and other animals were first vegetarians; then Noah and his sons were given permission to eat meat: “every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you” Genesis 9:3

    "A man may not care for golf and still be human, but the man who does not like to see, hunt, photograph or otherwise outwit birds or animals is hardly normal. He is supercivilized, and I for one do not know how to deal with him." Aldo Leopold

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    You think hormones and abx in meat are a good thing?

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    You pussies don't eat the tongue of your deer kills? Buncha amateurs round here...

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    Quote Originally Posted by quackaddict View Post

    You're welcome.
    I thought it was you, but couldn't remember 100%
    "This is My commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you." John 15:12

    "Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord." Hebrews 12:14

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    No murraywader he knows the traces of them in US meat is blown out of proportion to help market overpriced organic bullshit.

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    Deer heart is guuuddd.

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    Quote Originally Posted by murraywader View Post
    You think hormones and abx in meat are a good thing?
    I think there is a huge misunderstanding in the general public about hormones and antibiotics and food animals.


    I believe the vast majority of folks on the street will tell you that food animals are fed hormones and antibiotics ad libitum.

    At one point, I was the night manager of a commercial poultry feed mill. One of the maintenance folks was holding forth one night about the hormones fed to chickens. I asked him to point out the part in our process where we added hormones to the feed. He had no answer. He couldn't answer it because there aren't any hormones added to feed. But, because he had "heard somewhere" about hormones he was convinced they had to be in the feed... And he worked at a feed mill.

    It's hard for some folks to get over preconceived notions about the food animal industry. There is a ton of conflicting information available at the click of a mouse. I'm not going to tell you what to believe about the health issues associated with consuming store bought meat. I would just ask that you research both sides of the issue.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mobetter View Post
    At one point, I was the night manager of a commercial poultry feed mill. One of the maintenance folks was holding forth one night about the hormones fed to chickens. I asked him to point out the part in our process where we added hormones to the feed. He had no answer. He couldn't answer it because there aren't any hormones added to feed. But, because he had "heard somewhere" about hormones he was convinced they had to be in the feed... And he worked at a feed mill.
    That's terrible.

    The ONLY meat that has hormones added to it is beef. And the difference in the amounts in "hormone free" and implanted beef are measured in single NANOGRAMS. NANO... Not too mention, it's a naturally occuring hormone being used the vast majority of the time. If you eat cabbage, you have no reason to worry about the amount of estrogen added to your beef. There's LITERALLY over 400 times more estrogen in cabbage than beef. Is your girl friend/wife/daughter on birth control? If so, I'd be more worried about the amount of extra estrogen added to her body through birth control that from eating beef.

    Glenn, the reason that grass-fed is more costly is because of the amount of labor it takes to finish beef on grass. It's very, very labor intensive.
    Last edited by quackaddict; 09-30-2014 at 10:40 AM.
    Man and other animals were first vegetarians; then Noah and his sons were given permission to eat meat: “every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you” Genesis 9:3

    "A man may not care for golf and still be human, but the man who does not like to see, hunt, photograph or otherwise outwit birds or animals is hardly normal. He is supercivilized, and I for one do not know how to deal with him." Aldo Leopold

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    Quote Originally Posted by quackaddict View Post

    Glenn, the reason that grass-fed is more costly is because of the amount of labor it takes to finish beef on grass. It's very, very labor intensive.
    Elaborate. From the outside looking it, putting steers on a pasture seems pretty easy. But I admit ignorance when it comes to beef production.

    School me.

  20. #20
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    Why are new paleo diets and the true Paleolithic diet so far apart nutritionally? The answer lies in the differences between the meat and vegetables consumed today and those eaten in the Paleolithic era. The wild animals eaten then provided an estimated 6 to 16 percent of calories from fat compared to about 40 to 60 percent in today’s domestic animals—even those that are grass-fed. They were also free of added hormones, antibiotics, and environmental contaminants. All animal organs were consumed, and insects provided significant amounts of protein.
    can someone explain then?

    and yall know I am just messing with glenn on the age thing, but I DO think today's meat is different enough than the paleolithic meat that it bears discussion.
    Ugh. Stupid people piss me off.

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