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Thread: 223 vs 5.56 in SC

  1. #1
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    Default 223 vs 5.56 in SC

    I was in a new local gun store, or at least a new location, today with a gun novice friend of mine. Being a friend of mine may be a strike but he does fish and can call a turkey.

    Anyway, he asked the girl behind the counter what would be a good starter gun being that he thinks his son would like a rifle. She whipped out an AR 15 type gun that she explained was particularly good in SC because you could shoot both the 5.56 and the 223 round in it and what was so good is that the 223 is legal for deer hunting and the 5.56 is not. So she said.

    Huh?? what is this about? I have never heard such. Am I missing something?

    I asked if they had a mini 14 in. Nope. No clue. Fortunately a fella was listening in on this and pulled out a mini 30.
    It's not enough to simply tolerate the 2nd Amendment as an antiquated inconvenience. Caring for the 2nd Amendment means fighting to restore long lost rights.

  2. #2
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    On private land you can hunt deer with any caliber.
    Houndsmen are born, not made

    Quote Originally Posted by 2thDoc View Post
    I STAND WITH DUCK CUTTER!
    Quote Originally Posted by JABIII View Post
    I knew it wasn't real because no dogbox...

  3. #3
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    Hopefully she was moved back to her greeter position with quickness.
    The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is,
    as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.

    Thomas Jefferson

  4. #4
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    Mr Green Jeans texted me. He assured me that the 5.56 was available for use as a hunting cartridge. The restriction was on WMA where you should use a hunting appropriate bullet. As I would have thought.
    It's not enough to simply tolerate the 2nd Amendment as an antiquated inconvenience. Caring for the 2nd Amendment means fighting to restore long lost rights.

  5. #5
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    whats the difference between the min 14 and the mini 30?
    cut\'em

  6. #6
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    The 14 is a .223 the 30 is a 308 I believe

  7. #7
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    Mini 30 is 7.62x39.
    Last edited by duckchoppin; 02-16-2018 at 11:23 AM.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by duckchoppin View Post
    Mini 30 is 7.62x39.
    Correct. Had one and was not a fan.
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  9. #9
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    Buckytownsend. Go back to the greater position at the front of the store. Do not pass gardencenter and whipe up your drool


    If a man is alone in the woods, says something, and a woman does not hear, is he still wrong?

    Bipartisan usually means that a larger-than-usual deception is being carried out. —George Carlin

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  10. #10
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    Neck shot with the 5.56 hit spine & went straight out top of neck. .223 neck shot lodged in opposite shoulder. Both DRT.

  11. #11
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    My mini 30 is awesome- I like it more than an AR

  12. #12
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    There is confusion among many folks. The 5.56 and the 223 are interchangeable. Normally 5.56 is a military round with 55 or 62 gr full metal jacket bullets. The marketing folks wanted to make money so they introduced the 223 and chambered bolt action rifles for it. They both are primarily short range calibers as the Army Wound Ballistics Lab determined that after 95 yards the wound lethality of the 5.56 drops off quickly. If you want to get into the technical aspects of wound ballistics do a search for Col Martin Fackler MD wound ballistics and you will find out all kinds of neat information on terminal ballistics performance.

    If you have a nice commercial high grade bolt action rifle I would not run 5.56 milspec ammo though it as the US loaded 5.56 has WC846 ball propellant loaded in it and it does a number on your barrel quickly. You will have much longer barrel life reloading with stick propellant like 4198 and the Vihta Vouri propellants.

    Marty was a friend and he passed about two years ago down in Florida. If you happen to have a copy of NATO WAR SURGERY HANDBOOK look at the chapter on Missile Caused Wounds. Marty wrote that chapter.
    Last edited by Hummer; 02-21-2018 at 04:17 AM.
    Distinguished Rifleman High Power & Smallbore Prone, Presidents Hundred (Rifle), US Palma & Dewar Teams , Formerly US Army Picatinny Arsenal Small Cal Wpns Lab, Spec Projects Group Dover Devil Cal 50 Machinegun , Small Arms and Ammunition Test Director Aberdeen Prov Gnd, Member Int Wound Ballistics Assn., consultant to Fed Law Enf Tng Ctr, Glynco, US Border Pat, Defense Crim Inv Service, Army Munitions and Chem Cmd, Army Wound Ballistics Lab, NRA Life 1972, AC4HT, Firefighter 1, Shriner

  13. #13
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    "There is confusion among many folks. The 5.56 and the 223 are interchangeable."

    Are you sure about that? I've always understood that it's okay to shoot .223 in a 5.56.

    But not okay to shoot 5.56 in a .223.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by scatter shot View Post
    "There is confusion among many folks. The 5.56 and the 223 are interchangeable."

    Are you sure about that? I've always understood that it's okay to shoot .223 in a 5.56.

    But not okay to shoot 5.56 in a .223.
    This. The guy at the range told me to buy 5.56 for my .223. Then I was told by someone that there was a possibility it could blow up in the barrel.
    "I'm just a victim of a circumstance"

  15. #15
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    Urband legend. Next time somebody tells you that tell them lets make a bet on it. I tell them every time I fire a 5.56 NATO round in my Mod 70 Winchester and it doesn't blow up you give me 100.00. Every time my gun blows up I give you 100.00. I had a buddy who worked for Winchester at East Alton Plant and every time he heard that, he said "show me the rifle that blew up". No one ever could. Oh by the way have the exspurt better to show up with at least 100 one hundred dollar bills and we will both go together and buy the MILSPEC ammo in a sealed can from a dealer.

    I used to work Product Engineering for the Army Small Lab at Picatinny Arsenal, NJ and we had M16s come in about every five months that were reported " blown up". Not one of them had the empty case in the rifle which runs up a red flag quick and begging the question "WHY NOT?" NOTE here leaving a cleaning rod section in a barrel and shooting it will cause a case failure quickly.

    Not one of them showed signs of locking lug failure or barrel socket failure. That can only mean a case failure as the case acts like a breaker in your electrical box. Too much amp draw causes the breaker to trip and too much pressure will cause a case to fail before the gun fails.

    In high speed manufacturing on low speed loading lines very rarely a case will go down the line upside down and the case head gets annealed instead of the shoulder/neck area and that sets up a case failure quickly. That is why I prefer military brass to reload because (1) it has been proof fired which proves the case was made correctly. (2) military cases are much heavier than commercial cases down in the head area. (3) on unfired MILSPEC ammo sold everywhere in the brown cardboard boxes or 30/50 cal cans you can inspect every case to make sure the blue is at the neck/shoulder. If you ever see one with the case head/rim area blue DON'T SHOOT IT! ! ! ! !

    Picking up brass from the range is OK but if there has been a fire on the range or they were put in a burn barrel they are ruined for reloading purposes.

    Oh by the way there has NEVER been a reported case of bolt lug or barrel socket failure on the M16. As well I have never seen a barrel failure except from being shot out or a bore obstruction. Now that being said buying parts off the internet you don't know what you are getting to build your rifle as 95% of the parts on internet won't meet the gov't drawings. I have a buddy who was Procurement Contract Officer for the Army M16 parts and he was the one who told me 95% won't meet the drawings. Those parts the Army rejects the vendor is allowed to sell to recoup his production costs. You get what you pay for folks.
    Last edited by Hummer; 02-21-2018 at 04:16 PM.
    Distinguished Rifleman High Power & Smallbore Prone, Presidents Hundred (Rifle), US Palma & Dewar Teams , Formerly US Army Picatinny Arsenal Small Cal Wpns Lab, Spec Projects Group Dover Devil Cal 50 Machinegun , Small Arms and Ammunition Test Director Aberdeen Prov Gnd, Member Int Wound Ballistics Assn., consultant to Fed Law Enf Tng Ctr, Glynco, US Border Pat, Defense Crim Inv Service, Army Munitions and Chem Cmd, Army Wound Ballistics Lab, NRA Life 1972, AC4HT, Firefighter 1, Shriner

  16. #16
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    Thanks for taking the time to post all that but i have a wuestion. The post above seems to be citing performance data for the M16. I thought the M16 was chambered in 5.56 and as stated in my first post, you can shoot .223 in 5.56.
    Unless I missed it in your post, I didnt see any test data about shooting 5.56 in a .223.

  17. #17
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  18. #18
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    SAMMI and about a gazillion other sources. If you do shoot 5.56 in a .223, you may not have a catastrophic failure but it can still be damaging in some way to the gun, bore, chamber, etc.

    Hence, don't do it.
    Last edited by scatter shot; 02-22-2018 at 06:23 AM.

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