9mm vs .40 vs .45

[Swamp Rat]

I'm trying to remember working any case where a person was hit by an over-penetration, and frankly can't think of one.

[FishSticker]

So what you're saying is that you want to be one of the bodies??

Not at all. See FLS' response above. Threat reduction does not always have to be done by force. If outnumbered, putting some real estate between myself and the threat is high on my priority list. You can have illusions of grandeur all you want, but Wyatt Earp doesn't walk out of that Creek 99 times outta 100.

Give me time to get to the black gun so I can let it bark.

[DuvnDux]

The one I'm thinking of was in New York where NYPD put 20+ rounds in the guy and he wouldn't go down. They were using ball 9mm. That was one of the arguments/reasons we went with the .45.

[everlast]

NYPD put 20+ rounds in the guy and he wouldn't go down. .

Was his name bullet-tooth tony?

[led0321]

They were using ball 9mm.

.

[riverrat8991]

I like both 9mm and 45 but I will say I have been wanting to put down the 45 and carry a 9 how deep shit is getting I think I'd want more round count.

[Swamp Rat]

Here's the other thought. I have guns in all three calibers. 'Cause you never know what your ammo sources may be very long term.

[DuvnDux]

No, the case I was citing didn't happen in Hollywood. And yes it was said to be ball ammo. I wasn't there so I have no personal knowledge. I carry a 9mm and it's not ball either.

[BigBallin]

Here's the other thought. I have guns in all three calibers. 'Cause you never know what your ammo sources may be very long term.

.

[Griffin]

I have likely fired several thousand rounds of ammo in an actual gun fight. Of that maybe 200 were fired with the intent to kill. The rest was cover fire to facilitate movement. No none of them were on US soil. That fight is coming here and to think otherwise is foolish. A pistol should be nothing more than a means to fight your way to a much more powerful and higher capacity weapon. Bottom line carrying anything is better than nothing.

[murraywader]

Great point Griffin.

[Swamp Rat]

Don't bring a knife to a gunfight.

Don't bring a handgun to a long gun fight (unless it's to fight your way to the long gun).

Shoot 'em where they are biggest, a lot.

[Strick9]

Spot on in both posts Griff.

[CAMO SNOB]

9 for minor

40 for major

45 for single stack

38 Super for open

[crackshot]

I'm a single stack 45 guy all day long. I compete and have worked in LE and I prefer the 45 over every round i've tried. But it's more application driven than anything. The .40 is a compromise between the 9 and 45. It allows a higher capacity with a heavier round to compensate for the 9mm myth of over penetration. The .40 G21 makes an excellent duty weapon, high capacity, relatively inexpensive ammo, easy to maintain etc. For competition, I shoot 45 mostly but have moved to 9mm OPEN and have had fun with it. Another myth is 9mm recoil. A 9mm is more snappy than a 45, it's a different felt recoil. I can reduce my 45s to shoot flatter than an uncompensated 9mm however a comp'd 9mm shoots really well for speed shooting when you have hotter loads. With a 1911, the recoil spring can be reduced to the point that you can download .45s to the 650 - 700 fps range and the gun will track very well between splits and transitional shots. For the factory loads you can increase the spring weight to help it as well. With the Glock, you have a window of about 10.5 to a 12 pound recoil spring to work with on reduced loads so they are not as easy to slow down.
As for my personal carry, I chose the P238 in .380 only because it grips like a 1911 which I am extremely proficient with and I trust my shot placement ability. Most recorded defense situations are with 1 to 2 bad guys at close range. The truth of it is both the Glock and the 1911's are just bulky. Yes, you get a huge magazine capacity with the Glock and awesome take down with the 1911 but at the end of the day, neither is very easy to conceal. If it were an open carry state, things would be a lot different.

[CAMO SNOB]

If you are downloading your 45 to shoot less than 700 fps then you are not making major for USPSA SS or CDP for IDPA, both divisions require major. If you don't make major then you should be downloading 9 to 130 PF and have 10 in the gun for SS, switch to ESP if you hide.

[crackshot]

I shoot Steel Challenge with them. 120 PF is the minimun. Major in IDPA and IPSC is 165. I have a different load for that. Haven't got to shoot a lot of IDPA lately because I got bored with it and wanted to focus on SC. Minimum to meet 165 is about 720 fps btw. Even if I used them I wouldn't consider 20 fps difference "hiding".

[CAMO SNOB]

"Hiding" from targets = IDPA

[crackshot]

I stand corrected. Never heard of it called that but it makes perfect sense. I love steel. The pro-am stuff has been fun as well.

[Silentweapon338]

I have likely fired several thousand rounds of ammo in an actual gun fight. Of that maybe 200 were fired with the intent to kill. The rest was cover fire to facilitate movement. No none of them were on US soil. That fight is coming here and to think otherwise is foolish. A pistol should be nothing more than a means to fight your way to a much more powerful and higher capacity weapon. Bottom line carrying anything is better than nothing.

Your definition of a "truck gun" and mine are 2 totally different things.

But I completely agree with you.

So much so my golf cart has a bigger truck gun than most folks truck guns. Bahahahaha